Bitcoin Cash Node Reveals Upgrade Plans for May and ...

All ideas seem to be back on the table again: miner validated tokens, shortening the blocktime etc

Bitcoin Unlimited member Andrew Stone is arguing for his proposal group for miner validated tokens again in his latest read.cash article "BCH: Looking back and Moving forward" . Now under the initiative of George Donnelly, and supported by Jonathan Toomim, there's discussion again around shortening the blocktime on Bitcoin Cash.
Not that these aspects of the protocol are sacred but these things sound an awful lot like discussion already thoroughly had in 2018. As far as I'm concerned the takeaway was pretty decisively that miner validated tokens were not worth the tradeoff and hence SLP became the main BCH tokenspecification. If we were to change course on that now that would literally set BCH back two years. The takeaway on decreasing the blocktime (for me) was that it could not meaningfully improve the user experience and that pre-consensus was the correct way address the underlying problem. Make fun of roadmaps and stable protocol for businesses all you want but I think it's pretty sad, just like with the DAA, that BCH can't move forward and instead is resolving 2017 problems for the third time.
In the spirit of the IFP I only want to add this: You know who decreased blocktimes? Zcash, and now they're number 30 on coinmarketcap.
submitted by Mr-Zwets to btc [link] [comments]

the year 2020 in Bitcoin Cash so far: a detailed history

the year 2020 in Bitcoin Cash so far: a detailed history
What follows at the bottom is a four page long chronological overview of what happened in BCH in 2020 so far. To make it more digestable and fun to read I start with my narrating of the story.
My attempt was to remain as objective as possible and "let the facts speak for themselve" with everything sourced. I also link to many read.cash articles, the decision of which are the important ones to include is certainly not easy, I count on the rest of the community if I overlooked anything important.

summary & my narrating of the story:
The year started out relatively calm, with cashfusion in "the news" and an older ongoing controversy between Amaury and Roger Ver being worked out. Starting Jan 22nd all debate broke loose with the announcement of “Infrastructure Funding Plan for Bitcoin Cash” by Jiang Zhuoer of BTC.TOP. To illustrate this point 2 days later coinspice ran the title " Roger Ver Praises Vigorous Debate, [...]" and 6 days, less than a week, later Chris Pacia made a read.cash post titled "The 253rd "Thoughts on developer funding" Article" which might have been only a slight exaggeration or he might have been counting. Part of the reason of the tsunami was the lack of worked out details. By the time of Pacia's post a lot had changed: Both BU, Bitcoin Verde and a group of miners had made announcements not to go along with "the plan".
On feb 1st, the second version of the IFP was announced by Jiang Zhuoer in a post “BCH miner donation plan update”. Two weeks later on Feb 15th, the third iteration was announced by Bitcoin ABC which was to be activated by hashrate voting and on the same day Flipstarter was introduced, a sign of the search for alternative solutions. After a few more days and a few more people coming out more against the IFP (including Jonald Fyookball, Mark Lundeberg & Josh Ellithorpe), BCHN was announced on feb 20th with a formal release a week later. Also feb 27th, the DAA was brought back into the conversation by Jonathan Toomim with his " The BCH difficulty adjustment algorithm is broken. Here's how to fix it." video. By early march the IFP was effectively dead with its author Jiang Zhuoer vowing to vote against it. This became clear to everyone when ABC, a day later sudddenly shifted gears towards non-protocol, donation based funding: the IFP was dead. End march ABCs 2020 Business Plan was announced as a way to raise $3.3 million. Mid april to mid may was the high time for voluntary funding with four node implementations and General Protocols, a BCH DeFi Startup successfully raising funds.
By May 15th, the 6th HF network upgrade things had pretty much cooled down. The upgraded included nothing controversial and even saw an unexpected doubling in the unconfirmed transaction chain. June 15th a month later things started to heat up again with the BCHN announcement to remove the "poison pill" or "automatic replay protection". 8th Jul Jonathan Toomim posted "BCH protocol upgrade proposal: Use ASERT as the new DAA" which promised the solution to the long dragging DAA problem. Jul 23th however an unexpected twist occurred when Amaury Séchet posted "Announcing the Grasberg DAA" an incompatible, alternative solution. This, again, sparked a ton of debate and discussion. Grasberg lasted just two weeks from Jul 23th to Aug 6th when ABC announced its plans for the november 2020 upgrade but it had successfully united the opposition in the meanwhile. ABCs plan for november included dropping grasberg in favour of aserti3–2d and introducing IFPv4. Now we're here August 8th, the IFP which was declared dead after just over a month (Jan 22-Mar 5) is now back in full force. The rest of the history is still being written but if p2p electronic cash is to succeed in any big regard it's very thinkable that these events will get into history books.

Important resources: coinspice IFP timeline & Compiled list of BCH Miner Dev Fund posts, articles, discussions

History
Jan 13th : “Do CoinJoins Really Require Equal Transaction Amounts for Privacy? Part One: CashFusion” article by BitcoinMagazine [source]
Jan 13th : “Clearing the Way for Cooperation” Read.cash article by Amaury Séchet [source] on the controversy with Roger Ver about the amount of donations over the years
Jan 22nd : “Infrastructure Funding Plan for Bitcoin Cash” IFPv1 announced by Jiang Zhuoer of BTC.TOP [source] IFPv1: 12.5% of BCH coinbase rewards which will last for 6 months through a Hong Kong-based corporation & to be activated on May 15th
Jan 22nd : ”Bitcoin Cash Developers React to Infrastructure Fund Announcement: Cautiously Optimistic” coinspice article including Amaury Séchet, Antony Zegers, Jonald Fyookball & Josh Ellithorpe [source]
Jan 23rd : Jiang Zhuoer reddit AMA [source] [coinspice article]
Jan 23rd : Vitalik weighs in with his take on twitter [source]
Jan 23rd :” On the infrastructure funding plan for Bitcoin Cash” article by Amaury Séchet [source] [coinspice article] in which he proposed to place control of the IFP key in his hands together with Jonald Fyookball and Antony Zegers. . A group of 7 to 12 miners, developers, and businessmen in total would get an advisory function.
Jan 24th : “Bitcoin.com's Clarifications on the Miner Development Fund“ which emphasizes, among other things, the temporary and reversible nature of the proposal [source] [coinspice article]
Jan 24th : “Little Known (But Important!) Facts About the Mining Plan” Read.cash article by Jonald Fyookball in which he defended the IFP and stressed its necessity and temporary nature.
Jan 25th : massive amounts of public debate as documented by coinspice [coinspice article] with Justin Bons, Tobias Ruck and Antony Zegers explaining their take on it.
Jan 26th : public debate continues: “Assessment and proposal re: the Bitcoin Cash infrastructure funding situation” Read.cash article by imaginary_username [source] which was noteworthy in part because the post earned over Earns $1,000+ in BCH [coinspice article] and “The Best Of Intentions: The Dev Tax Is Intended to Benefit Investors But Will Corrupt Us Instead” by Peter Rizun [source]
Jan 27th : “We are a group of miners opposing the BTC.TOP proposal, here's why” article on Read.cash [source] [reddit announcement]
Jan 27th : Bitcoin Unlimited's BUIP 143: Refuse the Coinbase Tax [source][reddit announcement]
Jan 28th : “Bitcoin Verde's Response to the Miner Sponsored Development Fund” read.cash article by Josh Green in which he explains “Bitcoin Verde will not be implementing any node validation that enforces new coinbase rules.” [source]
Jan 28th : “Update on Developer Funding” read.cash article from Bitcoin.com [source] in which they state “As it stands now, Bitcoin.com will not go through with supporting any plan unless there is more agreement in the ecosystem such that the risk of a chain split is negligible.” And that “any funding proposal must be temporary and reversible.” This announcement from bitcoin.com and their mining pool lead the anonymous opposition miners to stand down. [source]
Jan 28th : The 253rd "Thoughts on developer funding" Article – by Chris Pacia, to tackle the “serious misconceptions in the community about how software development works”. He ends on a note of support for the IFP because of lack of realistic alternatives. [source]
Feb 1st: “BCH miner donation plan update” IFPv2 announced by Jiang Zhuoer of BTC.TOP [source] Which changes the donation mechanism so miners directly send part of their coinbase to the projects they wants to donate to. It would be activated with hashrate voting over a 3-month period with a 2/3 in favour requirement. The proposal also introduces a pilot period and a no donation option, Jiang Zhuoer also says he regards 12.% as too much.
Feb 7th: Group of BCH miners led by AsicSeer voice scepticism about the IFP during a reddit AMA [source]
Feb 15th: “On the Miner Infrastructure Funding Plan” article by Bitcoin ABC [source] In which they announce they will implement IFPv3 in their upcoming 0.21.0 release. This version has amount reduced to 5% of block reward and will go in effect with BIP 9 hashratevoting and a whitelist with different projects.
Feb 15th : “Introducing Flipstarter” [source]
Feb 16th :” Bitcoin.com’s stance on the recent block reward diversion proposals” video by Roger Ver on the Bitcoin.com Official Channel. [source] > Ver called Zhuoer’s IFP “clever” but ultimately “problematic.” [coinspice article]
Feb 16th :” BCH miner donation plan update again” read.cash article by Jiang Zhuoer of BTC.TOP [source] In which he briefly outlines the details of IFPv3
Feb 17th : “Latest Thoughts On Infrastructure Mining Plan” post by Jonald Fyookball [source]
Feb 17th : “Regarding the Bitcoin Cash Infrastructure Funding Plan, I am certain now that it should be scrapped immediately.” tweet by Mark Lundeberg [source]
Feb 19th : “Thoughts on the IFP - A Dev Perspective“ read.cash article by Josh Ellithorpe [source]
Feb 20th : “Bitcoin Cash Node” post announcing the new node implementation [source]
Feb 20th : First “Bitcoin Cash Developer Meeting” After IFP Proposal [source]
Feb 24th : “Flipstarter 500k, 6 independent campaigns” post announcing the goal to “fund the BCH ecosystem with 6 independent campaigns and an overall 500,000 USD target” [source]
Feb 27th : BCHN Formally Released [source]
Feb 27th : “The BCH difficulty adjustment algorithm is broken. Here's how to fix it.” Video by Jonathan Toomim [source]
Mar 3th :” Bitcoin Cash Node 2020: plans for May upgrade and beyond” post by BCHN [source]
Mar 4th :”Author of the Bitcoin Cash IFP [Jiang Zhuoer] Vows to Vote Against It, Using Personal Hash in Opposition” [source]
Mar 5th :Bitcoin ABC announces their 2020 Business Plan Fundraising for later in march [source]
Mar 15th : “EatBCH campaign funded! Next: node campaigns.” campaign funded after 11 hours [source]
Mar 30th : Bitcoin ABC 2020 Business Plan [source] $3.3 Million Fundraiser [source]
Apr 17th : Five flipstarter node campaign launched. [source]
Apr 26th : BCHN flipstarter campaign successfully funded. [source]
Apr 27th : VERDE flipstarter campaign successfully funded. [source]
May 4th : KNUTH flipstarter campaign successfully funded. [source]
May 7th : “BCH DeFi Startup General Protocols Raises Over $1 mil“ [source]
May 8th : BCHD flipstarter campaign successfully funded. [source]
May 9th : Deadline for node campaigns, ABC flipstarter campaign not funded. [source]
May 14th : “With IFP Defeated, Bitcoin ABC, ViaBTC & CoinEX CEO Publicly Consider a Bitcoin Cash Foundation” [source]
May 15th : deadline for ABC fundraiser campaign, ends at 55% completed. [source]
May 15th : 6th HF network upgrade -> new opcode op_Reversebytes, increased of the chained transaction limit from 25 to 50, and the improved counting of signature operations using the new “Sigchecks” implementation [source] with the “Controversial Funding Plan Rejected by Miners” [source]
May 25th : “Announcing the SLP Foundation” [source]
Jun 15st : “BCHN lead maintainer report 2020-06-15” announcement to remove the Automatic Replay Protection (a.k.a. the Poison Pill) from BCHN in november [source]
Jun 16st : “So [BCHN] is going to fork off from BCH at the next upgrade. Same old story. […]” tweeted Vin Armani [source]
Jun 21st : “Why Automatic Replay Protection Exists” post by Shammah Chancellor [source]
Jul 7th : “The Popular Stablecoin Tether Is Now Circulating on the Bitcoin Cash Network” [source]
Jul 8th : “BCH protocol upgrade proposal: Use ASERT as the new DAA” post by Jonathan Toomim [source]
Jul 18th : “$6M Worth of Tether on the Bitcoin Cash Chain Highlights the Benefits of SLP Tokens” [source]
Jul 23th : “Announcing the Grasberg DAA” post by Amaury Séchet[source]
Jul 24th : “Thoughts on Grasberg DAA” post by Mark Lundeberg [source]
Jul 29th : CashFusion security audit has been completed [source]
Jul 31st : Electron Cash 4.1.0 release with CashFusion support [source]
4th year, august 2020 – 2021
Aug 1st : “Bitcoin Cash: Scaling the Globe“ Online conference for ForkDay Celebration [source]
Aug 2nd : >“Is there going to be a fork between ABC and BCHN?” > “IMO it is very likely. If not in November, then next May.” – Amaury Séchet
Aug 3rd : “Dark secrets of the Grasberg DAA” post by Jonathan Toomim [source]
Aug 3rd : “Joint Statement On aserti3-2d Algorithm“ post by General Protocols, including Cryptophyl, Read.cash, Software Verde & SpinBCH [source]
Aug 3rd : Knuth announces they will be implementing aserti3-2d as DAA for november. [source]
Aug 3rd : Amaury rage quit from the developer call [source]
Aug 4th : “But why do people care about compensating for historical drift? Seems like a tiny problem and if it's causing this much social discord it seems not even worth bothering to try to fix.” Tweet by Vitalik [source]
Aug 5th : “Bitcoin Cash (BCH) November 2020 Upgrade statement” signed by BCHD, electron cash, VERDE, BU members, BCHN developers, Jonathan Toomim, Mark B. Lundeberg and many others [source]
Aug 5th : “BCHN FAQ on November 2020 Bitcoin Cash network upgrade” [source]
Aug 6th : “Bitcoin ABC’s plan for the November 2020 upgrade” [source] the announcement that they will drop Grasberg in favour of aserti3–2d (ASERT) and will also include FPv4 in which 8% of the blockreward goes to ABC as development funding.
Aug 7th : “Joint Statement from BCH Miners regarding Bitcoin ABC and the November 2020 BCH Upgrade.” Read.cash article by asicseer [source] stating “Over recent months, most miners and pools have switched to BCHN, and presently operate a majority of BCH hashrate.”
Aug 7th : “Simple Ledger Protocol's Joint Statement Regarding Bitcoin ABC on BCH's November 2020 Upgrade” read.cash post by the SLP-Foundation [source]
submitted by Mr-Zwets to btc [link] [comments]

Could it be We Just Need a Way to Veto Amaury? An Idea for Community Governance, Which May Solve Current IFP Too: Introducing The Governance Council

So I was inspired by a recent comment by u/jtoomim running this way:
"Everyone is wrong some of the time. We need a system in which one person being wrong about something doesn't doom us all. [...] In the USA, if the President vetos a bill, it can still be made into law of the Senate and House vote to override the veto with a two-thirds majority. Something like that could be helpful to BCH, too."
I think this is 100% spot on.
We face many challenges with Bitcoin Cash. The good news is we have some caring, amazing talent in this community, giving us the ability to overcome most if not any obstacle. However, our firepower isn't focused. We're far less capable/effective than we might be because of it. The problem is governance. If we can improve governance I think we can improve our chances at success at least ten times.
So I came up with an idea: The Governance Council
The idea behind the GC is giving us a powerful representative body for making community decisions. As the BCH community emerged from the split I think we were too busy putting out fires (cough CSW) to get something like this done. Now, however, I think it's more doable, maybe imperative. Think about how much admiration and respectful consideration we have for people like Roger Ver, Jonald Fyookball, Mark Lundeberg, Jonathan Toomim etc. Now imagine these people have zero official power to stand up against any decision Amaury makes. To be sure, they have political sway. They can publish blog or reddit posts to give people a sense where they stand, and that's something. However, it's not enough. For example, as it stands, because we recognize Amaury as technical decision maker, even if the overall sentiment of the community, including everyone I named, is against the BIP 9 IFP activation by hashpower, it doesn't matter because Amaury has sole recognized tech authority. Miners like Jiang reading/following along, as they said they would do, can only estimate at best what the community wants, and even then may unilaterally decide to go the other way for whatever reason. Worse, as has been mentioned, our fate may be determined by hashpower not even community friendly!
So, again, I think a GC can help. Imagine people as named were elected through a process (which I'll detail a little later what I have in mind), to form a council where their published votes formed a recognized resolution. Now, instead of selling coins, sitting depressed by the screen, debating the efficacy of yet another read.cash article to attempt to influence things as disjointed individuals, the chatter is 'how do you think so and so will vote?' 'when will the council vote?' 'have we had the vote yet?'. Everyone channels their focus to the Council making it far more clear to see, as a community, where we stand, because our individual positions are reflected cumulatively through empowered representatives.
This thing can have teeth too. For example, I foresee 9 seats total, elected annually. There can be a matching multisig address attached. So for a given resolution donated funding can be made available. This means the Council can erect things on its own, such as mining pools and or dev teams etc as needed to, if necessary, combat a rogue or enemy force. There really isn't a limit on what it can do, marketing, you name it. In this way, it can also help the IFP situation, by for example first coming up with a plan that is actually approved, and then if necessary funding it.
What do we think? Good idea? Move forward? I have much more in mind.
Edit: this doesn't eliminate the Lead Developer / Reference Implementation role now filled by Amaury. It works alongside it. This is a Separation of Powers. For example, the president of the United States can't just spend 1 billion dollars. He first asks Congress to approve it, then he spends it. What I have in mind works in a similar way for development. I just didn't go into details (for brevity) yet.
submitted by cryptos4pz to btc [link] [comments]

Could it be We Just Need a Way to Veto Amaury? An Idea for Community Governance, Which May Solve Current IFP Too: Introducing The Governance Council

So I was inspired by a recent comment by u/jtoomim running this way:
"Everyone is wrong some of the time. We need a system in which one person being wrong about something doesn't doom us all. [...] In the USA, if the President vetos a bill, it can still be made into law of the Senate and House vote to override the veto with a two-thirds majority. Something like that could be helpful to BCH, too."
I think this is 100% spot on.
We face many challenges with Bitcoin Cash. The good news is we have some caring, amazing talent in this community, giving us the ability to overcome most if not any obstacle. However, our firepower isn't focused. We're far less capable/effective than we might be because of it. The problem is governance. If we can improve governance I think we can improve our chances at success at least ten times.
So I came up with an idea: The Governance Council
The idea behind the GC is giving us a powerful representative body for making community decisions. As the BCH community emerged from the split I think we were too busy putting out fires (cough CSW) to get something like this done. Now, however, I think it's more doable, maybe imperative. Think about how much admiration and respectful consideration we have for people like Roger Ver, Jonald Fyookball, Mark Lundeberg, Jonathan Toomim etc. Now imagine these people have zero official power to stand up against any decision Amaury makes. To be sure, they have political sway. They can publish blog or reddit posts to give people a sense where they stand, and that's something. However, it's not enough. For example, as it stands, because we recognize Amaury as technical decision maker, even if the overall sentiment of the community, including everyone I named, is against the BIP 9 IFP activation by hashpower, it doesn't matter because Amaury has sole recognized tech authority. Miners like Jiang reading/following along, as they said they would do, can only estimate at best what the community wants, and even then may unilaterally decide to go the other way for whatever reason. Worse, as has been mentioned, our fate may be determined by hashpower not even community friendly!
So, again, I think a GC can help. Imagine people as named were elected through a process (which I'll detail a little later what I have in mind), to form a council where their published votes formed a recognized resolution. Now, instead of selling coins, sitting depressed by the screen, debating the efficacy of yet another read.cash article to attempt to influence things as disjointed individuals, the chatter is 'how do you think so and so will vote?' 'when will the council vote?' 'have we had the vote yet?'. Everyone channels their focus to the Council making it far more clear to see, as a community, where we stand, because our individual positions are reflected cumulatively through empowered representatives.
This thing can have teeth too. For example, I foresee 9 seats total, elected annually. There can be a matching multisig address attached. So for a given resolution donated funding can be made available. This means the Council can erect things on its own, such as mining pools and or dev teams etc as needed to, if necessary, combat a rogue or enemy force. There really isn't a limit on what it can do, marketing, you name it. In this way, it can also help the IFP situation, by for example first coming up with a plan that is actually approved, and then if necessary funding it.
What do we think? Good idea? Move forward? I have much more in mind.
submitted by cryptos4pz to Bitcoincash [link] [comments]

Bitcoin Cash Developers on "Nakamoto Consensus"

There has been a lot of discussion regarding the upcoming November upgrade and the "hash-war". This was brought up in the recent Bitcoin Cash developer Q&A.
I recommend anyone interested in the future of Bitcoin Cash to watch the whole interview, but in case you dont have the time I have time stamped a link to the part about Nakamoto Consensus HERE
The question being asked in the Q&A is:
"Why did Bitcoin ABC argue against using Nakamoto consensus as the governance model for BCH in the upcoming fork at the Bangkok meeting?"
To which Johnathan Toomim promptly answers:
"Because it doesn't work! Nakamoto Consensus would work for a soft fork but not a hard fork. You cant use a hash war to resolve this issue!
If you have different hard forking rule sets you are going to have a persistent chain split no matter what the hash rate distribution is.
whether or not we are willing to use Nakamoto consensus to resolve issues is not the issue right here. what the issue is, is that it is technically impossible."
Toomim's answer is quickly followed by Amaury Sachet:
"If you have an incompatible chain set you get a permanent chain split no matter what. Also I think that Nakamoto Consensus is probably quite misunderstood. People would do well to actually re-read the whitepaper on that front.
What the Nakamoto consensus describes generally is gonna be miners starting to enforce different rule sets and everybody is going to reorg into the longest chain. This is to decide among changes that are compatible with each other. Because if they are not compatible with each other nobody is going to reorg into any chain, and what you get is two chains. Nakamoto consensus can not resolve that!"
Toomim follows with the final comment:
"Nakamoto Consensus in the whitepaper is about determining which of several valid history's of transaction ordering is the true canonical ordering and which transactions are approved and confirmed and which ones are not. It is not for determining which rule sets!
The only decision Nakamoto Consensus is allowed to make, is on which of the various types of blocks or block contents (that would be valid according to the rule set) is the true history."

The implementations have incompatible rule sets just as BTC and BCH have. Nakamoto Consensus is possible for changes that are compatible (softforks) but not in the event of a hard fork. What I suspect we may see is an attempt of a 51% attack cleverly disguised as a "hash-war".


submitted by don-wonton to btc [link] [comments]

Subreddit Stats: btc top posts from 2019-01-06 to 2020-01-05 11:19 PDT

Period: 363.85 days
Submissions Comments
Total 1000 86748
Rate (per day) 2.75 237.19
Unique Redditors 317 7747
Combined Score 194633 356658

Top Submitters' Top Submissions

  1. 31014 points, 162 submissions: Egon_1
    1. Vitalik Buterin to Core Maxi: “ok bitcoiner” .... (515 points, 206 comments)
    2. These men are serving life without parole in max security prison for nonviolent drug offenses. They helped me through a difficult time in a very dark place. I hope 2019 was their last year locked away from their loved ones. FreeRoss.org/lifers/ Happy New Year. (502 points, 237 comments)
    3. "It’s official Burger King just accepted Bitcoin Cash and GoC token as a payment option in Slovenia." (423 points, 112 comments)
    4. "HOLY SATOSHI! 😱😱 I did it! A smart card that produces valid BitcoinCash signatures. Who would love to pay with a card—to a phone?? Tap took less than a second!👟..." (368 points, 105 comments)
    5. Chrome 'Has Become Surveillance Software. It's Time to Switch' -> Brave to support BCH! (330 points, 97 comments)
    6. Gavin Andresen (2017): "Running a network near 100% capacity is irresponsible engineering... " (316 points, 117 comments)
    7. "Evidently @github has banned all the Iranian users without an ability for them to download their repositories. A service like Github must be a public good and must not be controlled by a centralized entity. Another great example of why we as a society need to make web3 a reality" (314 points, 117 comments)
    8. Roger Ver: "Bitcoin Cash acceptance is coming to thousands of physical shops in Korea" (313 points, 120 comments)
    9. Paul Sztorc: “Will people really spend $70-$700 to open/modify a lightning channel when there's an Altcoin down the street which will process a (USD-denominated) payment for $0.05 ? Many people seem to think yes but honestly I just don't get it” (306 points, 225 comments)
    10. Food For Thought (303 points, 105 comments)
  2. 29021 points, 157 submissions: MemoryDealers
    1. Bitcoin Cash is Lightning Fast! (No editing needed) (436 points, 616 comments)
    2. Brains..... (423 points, 94 comments)
    3. Meanwhile in Hong Kong (409 points, 77 comments)
    4. Ross Ulbricht has served 6 years in federal prison. (382 points, 156 comments)
    5. Just another day at the Bitcoin Cash accepting super market in Slovenia. (369 points, 183 comments)
    6. Why I'm not a fan of the SV community: My recent bill for defending their frivolous lawsuit against open source software developers. (369 points, 207 comments)
    7. History Reminder: (354 points, 245 comments)
    8. It's more decentralized this way. (341 points, 177 comments)
    9. The new Bitcoin Cash wallet is so fast!!!!! (327 points, 197 comments)
    10. The IRS wants to subpoena Apple and Google to see if you have downloaded crypto currency apps. (324 points, 178 comments)
  3. 6909 points, 37 submissions: BitcoinXio
    1. Tim Pool on Twitter: “How the fuck are people justifying creating a world like the one's depicted in Fahrenheit 451 and 1984? You realize that censorship and banning information was a key aspect of the dystopian nightmare right?” (435 points, 75 comments)
    2. The creator of the now famous HODL meme says that the HODL term has been corrupted and doesn’t mean what he intended; also mentions that the purpose of Bitcoin is to spend it and that BTC has lost its value proposition. (394 points, 172 comments)
    3. Erik Voorhees on Twitter: “I wonder if you realize that if Bitcoin didn’t work well as a payment system in the early days it likely would not have taken off. Many (most?) people found the concept of instant borderless payments captivating and inspiring. “Just hold this stuff” not sufficient.” (302 points, 66 comments)
    4. Bitfinex caught paying a company to astroturf on social media including Reddit, Twitter, Medium and other platforms (285 points, 86 comments)
    5. WARNING: If you try to use the Lightning Network you are at extremely HIGH RISK of losing funds and is not recommended or safe to do at this time or for the foreseeable future (274 points, 168 comments)
    6. Craig Wright seems to have rage quit Twitter (252 points, 172 comments)
    7. No surprise here: Samson Mow among other BTC maxi trolls harassed people to the point of breakdown (with rape threats, etc) (249 points, 85 comments)
    8. On Twitter: “PSA: The Lightning Network is being heavily data mined right now. Opening channels allows anyone to cluster your wallet and associate your keys with your IP address.” (228 points, 102 comments)
    9. btc is being targeted and attacked, yet again (220 points, 172 comments)
    10. Brian Armstrong CEO of Coinbase using Bitcoin Cash (BCH) to pay for food, video in tweet (219 points, 66 comments)
  4. 6023 points, 34 submissions: money78
    1. BSV in a nutshell... (274 points, 60 comments)
    2. There is something going on with @Bitcoin twitter account: 1/ The URL of the white paper has been changed from bitcoin.com into bitcoin.org! 2/ @Bitcoin has unfollowed all other BCH related accounts. 3/ Most of the posts that refer to "bitcoin cash" have been deleted?!! Is it hacked again?! (269 points, 312 comments)
    3. "Not a huge @rogerkver fan and never really used $BCH. But he wiped up the floor with @ToneVays in Malta, and even if you happen to despise BCH, it’s foolish and shortsighted not to take these criticisms seriously. $BTC is very expensive and very slow." (262 points, 130 comments)
    4. Jonathan Toomim: "At 32 MB, we can handle something like 30% of Venezuela's population using BCH 2x per day. Even if that's all BCH ever achieved, I'd call that a resounding success; that's 9 million people raised out of poverty. Not a bad accomplishment for a hundred thousand internet geeks." (253 points, 170 comments)
    5. Jonathan Toomim: "BCH will not allow block sizes that are large enough to wreak havoc. We do our capacity engineering before lifting the capacity limits. BCH's limit is 32 MB, which the network can handle. BSV does not share this approach, and raises limits before improving actual capacity." (253 points, 255 comments)
    6. What Bitcoin Cash has accomplished so far 💪 (247 points, 55 comments)
    7. Which one is false advertising and misleading people?! Bitcoin.com or Bitcoin.org (232 points, 90 comments)
    8. A message from Lightning Labs: "Don't put more money on lightning than you're willing to lose!" (216 points, 118 comments)
    9. Silk Road’s Ross Ulbricht thanks Bitcoin Cash’s [BCH] Roger Ver for campaigning for his release (211 points, 29 comments)
    10. This account just donated more than $6600 worth of BCH via @tipprbot to multiple organizations! (205 points, 62 comments)
  5. 4514 points, 22 submissions: unstoppable-cash
    1. Reminder: bitcoin mods removed top post: "The rich don't need Bitcoin. The poor do" (436 points, 89 comments)
    2. Peter R. Rizun: "LN User walks into a bank, says "I need a loan..." (371 points, 152 comments)
    3. It was SO simple... Satoshi had the answer to prevent full-blocks back in 2010! (307 points, 150 comments)
    4. REMINDER: "Bitcoin isn't for people that live on less than $2/day" -Samson Mow, CSO of BlockStream (267 points, 98 comments)
    5. "F'g insane... waited 5 hrs and still not 1 confirmation. How does anyone use BTC over BCH BitcoinCash?" (258 points, 222 comments)
    6. Irony:"Ave person won't be running LN routing node" But CORE/BTC said big-blocks bad since everyone can't run their own node (256 points, 161 comments)
    7. BitPay: "The Wikimedia Foundation had been accepting Bitcoin for several years but recently switched pmt processors to BitPay so they can now accept Bitcoin Cash" (249 points, 61 comments)
    8. FreeTrader: "Decentralization is dependent on widespread usage..." (195 points, 57 comments)
    9. The FLIPPENING: Fiat->OPEN Peer-to-Peer Electronic Cash! Naomi Brockwell earning more via BitBacker than Patreon! (193 points, 12 comments)
    10. LN Commentary from a guy that knows a thing or 2 about Bitcoin (Gavin Andresen-LEAD developer after Satoshi left in 2010) (182 points, 80 comments)
  6. 3075 points, 13 submissions: BeijingBitcoins
    1. Last night's BCH & BTC meetups in Tokyo were both at the same restaurant (Two Dogs). We joined forces for this group photo! (410 points, 166 comments)
    2. Chess.com used to accept Bitcoin payments but, like many other businesses, disabled the option. After some DMs with an admin there, I'm pleased to announce that they now accept Bitcoin Cash! (354 points, 62 comments)
    3. WSJ: Bitfinex Used Tether Reserves to Mask Missing $850 Million, Probe Finds (348 points, 191 comments)
    4. Bitcoiners: Then and Now [MEME CONTEST - details in comments] (323 points, 72 comments)
    5. I'd post this to /Bitcoin but they would just remove it right away (also I'm banned) (320 points, 124 comments)
    6. So this is happening at the big protest in Hong Kong right now (270 points, 45 comments)
    7. /Bitcoin mods are censoring posts that explain why BitPay has to charge an additional fee when accepting BTC payments (219 points, 110 comments)
    8. The guy who won this week's MillionaireMakers drawing has received ~$55 in BCH and ~$30 in BTC. It will cost him less than $0.01 to move the BCH, but $6.16 (20%) in fees to move the BTC. (164 points, 100 comments)
    9. The Bitcoin whitepaper was published 11 years ago today. Check out this comic version of the whitepaper, one of the best "ELI5" explanations out there. (153 points, 12 comments)
    10. Two Years™ is the new 18 Months™ (142 points, 113 comments)
  7. 2899 points, 18 submissions: jessquit
    1. Oh, the horror! (271 points, 99 comments)
    2. A few days ago I caught flak for reposting a set of graphs that didn't have their x-axes correctly labeled or scaled. tvand13 made an updated graph with correct labeling and scaling. I am reposting it as I promised. I invite the viewer to draw their own conclusions. (214 points, 195 comments)
    3. Do you think Bitcoin needs to increase the block size? You're in luck! It already did: Bitcoin BCH. Avoid the upcoming controversial BTC block size debate by trading your broken Bitcoin BTC for upgraded Bitcoin BCH now. (209 points, 194 comments)
    4. Master list of evidence regarding Bitcoin's hijacking and takeover by Blockstream (185 points, 113 comments)
    5. PSA: BTC not working so great? Bitcoin upgraded in 2017. The upgraded Bitcoin is called BCH. There's still time to upgrade! (185 points, 192 comments)
    6. Nobody uses Bitcoin Cash (182 points, 88 comments)
    7. Double-spend proofs, SPV fraud proofs, and Cashfusion improvements all on the same day! 🏅 BCH PLS! 🏅 (165 points, 36 comments)
    8. [repost] a reminder on how btc and Bitcoin Cash came to be (150 points, 102 comments)
    9. Holy shit the entire "negative with gold" sub has become a shrine devoted to the guilded astroturfing going on in rbtc (144 points, 194 comments)
    10. This sub is the only sub in all of Reddit that allows truly uncensored discussion of BTC. If it turns out that most of that uncensored discussion is negative, DON'T BLAME US. (143 points, 205 comments)
  8. 2839 points, 13 submissions: SwedishSalsa
    1. With Bitcoin, for the first time in modern history, we have a way to opt out. (356 points, 100 comments)
    2. In this age of rampant censorship and control, this is why I love Bitcoin. (347 points, 126 comments)
    3. The crypto expert (303 points, 29 comments)
    4. Satoshi reply to Mike Hearn, April 2009. Everybody, especially newcomers and r-bitcoin-readers should take a step back and read this. (284 points, 219 comments)
    5. Bitcoin Cash looking good lately. (235 points, 33 comments)
    6. Roger Ver bad (230 points, 61 comments)
    7. History of the BTC scaling debate (186 points, 54 comments)
    8. MFW i read Luke Jr wants to limit BTC blocks to 300k. (183 points, 116 comments)
    9. Meanwhile over at bitcoinsv... (163 points, 139 comments)
    10. Listen people... (155 points, 16 comments)
  9. 2204 points, 10 submissions: increaseblocks
    1. China bans Bitcoin again, and again, and again (426 points, 56 comments)
    2. China bans Bitcoin (again) (292 points, 35 comments)
    3. Bitcoin Cash Network has now been upgraded! (238 points, 67 comments)
    4. So you want small blocks with high fees to validate your own on chain transactions that happen OFF CHAIN? (212 points, 112 comments)
    5. It’s happening - BTC dev Luke jr writing code to Bitcoin BTC codebase to fork to lower the block size to 300kb! (204 points, 127 comments)
    6. Former BTC maximalist admits that maxi's lied cheated and stealed to get SegWit and Lightning (201 points, 135 comments)
    7. Just 18 more months to go! (172 points, 86 comments)
    8. Bitcoin Cash ring - F*CK BANKS (167 points, 51 comments)
    9. LTC Foundation chat leaked: no evidence of development, lack of transparency (155 points, 83 comments)
    10. A single person controls nearly half of all the Lightning Network’s capacity (137 points, 109 comments)
  10. 2138 points, 12 submissions: JonyRotten
    1. 'Craig Is a Liar' – Early Adopter Proves Ownership of Bitcoin Address Claimed by Craig Wright (309 points, 165 comments)
    2. 200,000 People Have Signed Ross Ulbricht's Clemency Petition (236 points, 102 comments)
    3. Street Artist Hides $1,000 in BTC Inside a Mural Depicting Paris Protests (236 points, 56 comments)
    4. Craig Wright Ordered to Produce a List of Early Bitcoin Addresses in Kleiman Lawsuit (189 points, 66 comments)
    5. Ross Ulbricht Clemency Petition Gathers 250,000 Signatures (163 points, 24 comments)
    6. Ross Ulbricht Letter Questions the Wisdom of Imprisoning Non-Violent Offenders (160 points, 50 comments)
    7. Expert Witness in Satoshi Case Claims Dr Wright's Documents Were Doctored (155 points, 44 comments)
    8. California City Official Uses Bitcoin Cash to Purchase Cannabis (151 points, 36 comments)
    9. Money Transmitter License Not Required for Crypto Businesses in Pennsylvania (141 points, 9 comments)
    10. McAfee to Launch Decentralized Token Exchange With No Restrictions (137 points, 35 comments)

Top Commenters

  1. jessquit (16708 points, 2083 comments)
  2. Ant-n (7878 points, 1517 comments)
  3. MemoryDealers (7366 points, 360 comments)
  4. Egon_1 (6205 points, 1001 comments)
  5. 500239 (5745 points, 735 comments)
  6. BitcoinXio (4640 points, 311 comments)
  7. LovelyDay (4353 points, 457 comments)
  8. chainxor (4293 points, 505 comments)
  9. MobTwo (3420 points, 174 comments)
  10. ShadowOfHarbringer (3388 points, 478 comments)

Top Submissions

  1. The perfect crypto t-shirt by Korben (742 points, 68 comments)
  2. The future of Libra Coin by themadscientistt (722 points, 87 comments)
  3. when you become a crypto trader... by forberniesnow (675 points, 54 comments)
  4. A Reminder Why You Shouldn’t Use Google. by InMyDayTVwasBooks (637 points, 209 comments)
  5. Imagine if in 2000 Apple just sat around all day shit-talking Microsoft. Apple would have never gone anywhere. Apple succeeded because they learned from their mistakes, improved, and got better. BCH should do the same. by guyfawkesfp (552 points, 255 comments)
  6. Bitcoin made The Simpsons intro! Sorry for the potato quality by Johans_wilgat (521 points, 44 comments)
  7. Vitalik Buterin to Core Maxi: “ok bitcoiner” .... by Egon_1 (515 points, 206 comments)
  8. Can't stop won't stop by Greentoboggan (514 points, 78 comments)
  9. These men are serving life without parole in max security prison for nonviolent drug offenses. They helped me through a difficult time in a very dark place. I hope 2019 was their last year locked away from their loved ones. FreeRoss.org/lifers/ Happy New Year. by Egon_1 (502 points, 237 comments)
  10. Blockchain? by unesgt (479 points, 103 comments)

Top Comments

  1. 211 points: fireduck's comment in John Mcafee on the run from IRS Tax Evasion charges, running 2020 Presidential Campaign from Venezuela in Exile
  2. 203 points: WalterRothbard's comment in I am a Bitcoin supporter and developer, and I'm starting to think that Bitcoin Cash could be better, but I have some concerns, is anyone willing to discuss them?
  3. 179 points: Chris_Pacia's comment in The BSV chain has just experienced a 6-block reorg
  4. 163 points: YourBodyIsBCHn's comment in I made this account specifically to tip in nsfw/gonewild subreddits
  5. 161 points: BeijingBitcoins's comment in Last night's BCH & BTC meetups in Tokyo were both at the same restaurant (Two Dogs). We joined forces for this group photo!
  6. 156 points: hawks5999's comment in You can’t make this stuff up. This is how BTC supporters actually think. From bitcoin: “What you can do to make BTC better: check twice if you really need to use it!” 🤦🏻‍♂️
  7. 155 points: lowstrife's comment in Steve Wozniak Sold His Bitcoin at Its Peak $20,000 Valuation
  8. 151 points: kdawgud's comment in The government is taking away basic freedoms we each deserve
  9. 147 points: m4ktub1st's comment in BCH suffered a 51% attack by colluding miners to re-org the chain in order to reverse transactions - why is nobody talking about this? Dangerous precident
  10. 147 points: todu's comment in Why I'm not a fan of the SV community: My recent bill for defending their frivolous lawsuit against open source software developers.
Generated with BBoe's Subreddit Stats
submitted by subreddit_stats to subreddit_stats [link] [comments]

A Response to Roger Ver

This post was inspired by the video “Roger Ver’s Thoughts on Craig Wright”. Oh, wait. Sorry. “Roger Ver’s Thoughts on 15th November Bitcoin Cash Upgrade”. Not sure how I mixed those two up.
To get it out of the way first and foremost: I have nothing but utmost respect for Roger Ver. You have done more than just about anyone to bring Bitcoin to the world, and for that you will always have my eternal gratitude. While there are trolls on both sides, the crucifixion of Bitcoin Jesus in the past week has been disheartening to see. As a miner, I respect his decision to choose the roadmap that he desires.
It is understandable that the Bitcoin (BCH) upgrade is causing a clash of personalities. However, what has been particularly frustrating is the lack of debate around the technical merits of Bitcoin ABC vs Bitcoin SV. The entire conversation has now revolved around Craig Wright the individual instead of what is best for Bitcoin Cash moving forward.
Roger’s video did confirm something about difference of opinions between the Bitcoin ABC and Bitcoin SV camps. When Roger wasn’t talking about Craig Wright, he spent a portion of his video discussing how individuals should be free to trade drugs without the intervention of the state. He used this position to silently attack Craig Wright for allegedly wanting to control the free trade of individuals. This appears to confirm what Craig Wright has been saying: that DATASIGVERIFY can be used to enable widely illegal use-cases of transactions, and Roger’s support for the ABC roadmap stems from his personal belief that Bitcoin should enable all trade regardless of legal status across the globe.
Speaking for myself, I think the drug war is immoral. I think human beings should be allowed to put anything they want in their own bodies as long as they are not harming others. I live in the United States and have personally seen the negative consequences of the drug war. This is a problem. The debasement of our currency and theft at the hands of central banks is a separate problem. Bitcoin was explicitly created to solve one of these problems.
Roger says in his video that “cryptocurrencies” were created to enable trade free from government oversight. However, Satoshi Nakamoto never once said this about Bitcoin. Satoshi Nakamoto was explicitly clear, however, that Bitcoin provided a solution to the debasement of currency.
“The root problem with conventional currency is all the trust that's required to make it work. The central bank must be trusted not to debase the currency, but the history of fiat currencies is full of breaches of that trust.” – Satoshi Nakamoto 02/11/2009
As we’ve written previously, the genesis block is often cited as a criticism of the 2008 bailout. However, the content of the article outlines that the bailout had already occurred. The article reveals that the government was poised to go a step further by buying up the toxic bank assets as part of a nationalization effort! In this scenario, according to the Times, "a 'bad bank' would be created to dispose of bad debts. The Treasury would take bad loans off the hands of troubled banks, perhaps swapping them for government bonds. The toxic assets, blamed for poisoning the financial system, would be parked in a state vehicle or 'bad bank' that would manage them and attempt to dispose of them while 'detoxifying' the main-stream banking system." The article outlines a much more nightmarish scenario than bank bailouts, one that would effectively remove any element of private enterprise from banking and use the State to seize the bank's assets.
The United States is progressively getting to a point where cannabis can be freely traded and used without legal repercussion. As a citizen, each election has given me the opportunity to bring us closer to enacting that policy at a national level. However, I have never had the ability to have a direct impact on preventing the debasement of the United States dollar. The dollar is manipulated by a “private” organization that is accountable to no one, and on a yearly basis we are given arbitrary interest rates that I have no control over. The government uses its arbitrary control over the money supply to enable itself to spend trillions of dollars it doesn’t have on foreign wars. Roger Ver has passionately argued against this in multiple videos available on the internet.
This is what Bitcoin promised to me when I first learned about it. This is what makes it important to me.
When the Silk Road was shut down, Bitcoin was unaffected. Bitcoin, like the US dollar, was just a tool that was used for transactions. There is an inherent danger that governments, whether you like it or not, would use every tool at their disposal to shut down any system that enabled at a protocol level illegal trade. They, rightfully or wrongfully, did this with the Silk Road. Roger’s video seems to hint that he thinks Bitcoin Cash should be an experiment in playing chicken with governments across the world about our right to trade freely without State intervention. The problem is that this is a vast underestimation of just how quickly Bitcoin (BCH) could be shut down if the protocol itself was the tool being used for illegal trade instead of being the money exchanged on top of illegal trade platforms.
I don’t necessarily agree or disagree with Roger’s philosophy on what “cryptocurrencies” should be. However, I know what Bitcoin is. Bitcoin is simply hard, sound money. That is boring to a lot of those in the “cryptocurrency” space, but it is the essential tool that enables freedom for the globe. It allows those in Zimbabwe to have sound currency free from the 50 billion dollar bills handed out like candy by the government. It allows those of us in the US to be free from the arbitrary manipulation of the Fed. Hard, sound, unchanging money that can be used as peer to peer digital cash IS the killer use case of Bitcoin. That is why we are here building on top of Bitcoin Cash daily.
When Roger and ABC want to play ball with governments across the globe and turn Bitcoin into something that puts it in legal jeopardy, it threatens the value of my bitcoins. Similar to the uncertainty we go through in the US every year as we await the arbitrary interest rates handed out by the Fed, we are now going to wait in limbo to see if governments will hold Bitcoin Cash miners responsible for enabling illegal trade at a protocol level. This is an insanely dangerous prospect to introduce to Bitcoin (BCH) so early in its lifespan. In one of Satoshi Nakamoto’s last public posts, he made it clear just how important it was to not kick the hornet’s nest that is government:
“It would have been nice to get this attention in any other context. WikiLeaks has kicked the hornet's nest, and the swarm is headed towards us.” – Satoshi Nakamoto 12/11/2010
Why anyone would want to put our opportunity of sound monetary policy in jeopardy to enable illegal trading at a base protocol level is beyond me. I respect anyone who has an anarcho-capitalist ideology. But, please don’t debase my currency by putting it at risk of legal intervention because you want to impose that ideology on the world.
We took the time to set up a Q&A with the Bitcoin SV developers Steve Shadders and Daniel Connolly. We posted on Reddit and gathered a ton of questions from the “community”. We received insanely intelligent, measured, and sane responses to all of the “attack vectors” proposed against increasing the block size and re-enabling old opcodes. Jonathon Toomim spent what must have been an hour or so asking 15+ questions in the Reddit thread of which we obtained answers to most. We have yet to see him respond to the technical answers given by the SV team. In Roger’s entire video today about the upcoming November fork, he didn’t once mention one reason why he disagrees with the SV roadmap. Instead, he has decided to go on Reddit and use the same tactics that were used by Core against Bitcoin Unlimited back in the day by framing the upcoming fork as “BCH vs BSV”, weeks before miners have had the ability to actually vote.
What Bitcoin SV wants to accomplish is enable sound money for the globe. This is boring. This is not glamorous. It is, however, the greatest tool of freedom we can give the globe. We cannot let ideology or personalities change that goal. Ultimately, it won’t. We have been continual advocates for miners, the ones who spend 1000x more investing in the network than the /btc trolls, to decide the future of BCH. We look forward to seeing what they choose on Nov 15th.
Roger mentions that it is our right to fork off and create our own chains. While that is okay to have as an opinion, Satoshi Nakamoto was explicit that we should be building one global chain. We adhere to the idea that miners should vote with their hashpower and determine the emergent chain after November 15th.
“It is strictly necessary that the longest chain is always considered the valid one. Nodes that were present may remember that one branch was there first and got replaced by another, but there would be no way for them to convince those who were not present of this. We can't have subfactions of nodes that cling to one branch that they think was first, others that saw another branch first, and others that joined later and never saw what happened. The CPU proof-of-worker proof-of-work vote must have the final say. The only way for everyone to stay on the same page is to believe that the longest chain is always the valid one, no matter what.” – Satoshi Nakamoto 11/09/2008
Edit: A clarification. I used the phrase "Bitcoin is boring". I want to clarify that Bitcoin itself is capable of far more than we've ever thought possible, and this statement is one I will be elaborating on further in the future.
submitted by The_BCH_Boys to btc [link] [comments]

Where did Bitcoin Classic suddenly appear from?

I'm pretty much paying attention to all of this. Post here every day. But I don't understand. Where did this classic come from?
I swear it was only a week ago that everyone was in a stalemate still. I remember XT being on the table, but nothing really else happening.
Then like in the last seven days I started hearing about classic, and suddenly 49% support it? What is it? How did it get so much support in a week?
submitted by BitttBurger to btc [link] [comments]

A technical dive into CTOR

Over the last several days I've been looking into detail at numerous aspects of the now infamous CTOR change to that is scheduled for the November hard fork. I'd like to offer a concrete overview of what exactly CTOR is, what the code looks like, how well it works, what the algorithms are, and outlook. If anyone finds the change to be mysterious or unclear, then hopefully this will help them out.
This document is placed into public domain.

What is TTOR? CTOR? AOR?

Currently in Bitcoin Cash, there are many possible ways to order the transactions in a block. There is only a partial ordering requirement in that transactions must be ordered causally -- if a transaction spends an output from another transaction in the same block, then the spending transaction must come after. This is known as the Topological Transaction Ordering Rule (TTOR) since it can be mathematically described as a topological ordering of the graph of transactions held inside the block.
The November 2018 hard fork will change to a Canonical Transaction Ordering Rule (CTOR). This CTOR will enforce that for a given set of transactions in a block, there is only one valid order (hence "canonical"). Any future blocks that deviate from this ordering rule will be deemed invalid. The specific canonical ordering that has been chosen for November is a dictionary ordering (lexicographic) based on the transaction ID. You can see an example of it in this testnet block (explorer here, provided this testnet is still alive). Note that the txids are all in dictionary order, except for the coinbase transaction which always comes first. The precise canonical ordering rule can be described as "coinbase first, then ascending lexicographic order based on txid".
(If you want to have your bitcoin node join this testnet, see the instructions here. Hopefully we can get a public faucet and ElectrumX server running soon, so light wallet users can play with the testnet too.)
Another ordering rule that has been suggested is removing restrictions on ordering (except that the coinbase must come first) -- this is known as the Any Ordering Rule (AOR). There are no serious proposals to switch to AOR but it will be important in the discussions below.

Two changes: removing the old order (TTOR->AOR), and installing a new order (AOR->CTOR)

The proposed November upgrade combines two changes in one step:
  1. Removing the old causal rule: now, a spending transaction can come before the output that it spends from the same block.
  2. Adding a new rule that fixes the ordering of all transactions in the block.
In this document I am going to distinguish these two steps (TTOR->AOR, AOR->CTOR) as I believe it helps to clarify the way different components are affected by the change.

Code changes in Bitcoin ABC

In Bitcoin ABC, several thousand lines of code have been changed from version 0.17.1 to version 0.18.1 (the current version at time of writing). The differences can be viewed here, on github. The vast majority of these changes appear to be various refactorings, code style changes, and so on. The relevant bits of code that deal with the November hard fork activation can be found by searching for "MagneticAnomaly"; the variable magneticanomalyactivationtime sets the time at which the new rules will activate.
The main changes relating to transaction ordering are found in the file src/validation.cpp:
There are other changes as well:

Algorithms

Serial block processing (one thread)

One of the most important steps in validating blocks is updating the unspent transaction outputs (UTXO) set. It is during this process that double spends are detected and invalidated.
The standard way to process a block in bitcoin is to loop through transactions one-by-one, removing spent outputs and then adding new outputs. This straightforward approach requires exact topological order and fails otherwise (therefore it automatically verifies TTOR). In pseudocode:
for tx in transactions: remove_utxos(tx.inputs) add_utxos(tx.outputs) 
Note that modern implementations do not apply these changes immediately, rather, the adds/removes are saved into a commit. After validation is completed, the commit is applied to the UTXO database in batch.
By breaking this into two loops, it becomes possible to update the UTXO set in a way that doesn't care about ordering. This is known as the outputs-then-inputs (OTI) algorithm.
for tx in transactions: add_utxos(tx.outputs) for tx in transactions: remove_utxos(tx.inputs) 
Benchmarks by Jonathan Toomim with Bitcoin ABC, and by myself with ElectrumX, show that the performance penalty of OTI's two loops (as opposed to the one loop version) is negligible.

Concurrent block processing

The UTXO updates actually form a significant fraction of the time needed for block processing. It would be helpful if they could be parallelized.
There are some concurrent algorithms for block validation that require quasi-topological order to function correctly. For example, multiple workers could process the standard loop shown above, starting at the beginning. A worker temporarily pauses if the utxo does not exist yet, since it's possible that another worker will soon create that utxo.
There are issues with such order-sensitive concurrent block processing algorithms:
In contrast, the OTI algorithm's loops are fully parallelizable: the worker threads can operate in an independent manner and touch transactions in any order. Until recently, OTI was thought to be unable to verify TTOR, so one reason to remove TTOR was that it would allow changing to parallel OTI. It turns out however that this is not true: Jonathan Toomim has shown that TTOR enforcement is easily added by recording new UTXOs' indices within-block, and then comparing indices during the remove phase.
In any case, it appears to me that any concurrent validation algorithm would need such additional code to verify that TTOR is being exactly respected; thus for concurrent validation TTOR is a hindrance at best.

Advanced parallel techniques

With Bitcoin Cash blocks scaling to large sizes, it may one day be necessary to scale onto advanced server architectures involving sharding. A lot of discussion has been made over this possibility, but really it is too early to start optimizing for sharding. I would note that at this scale, TTOR is not going to be helpful, and CTOR may or may not lead to performance optimizations.

Block propagation (graphene)

A major bottleneck that exists in Bitcoin Cash today is block propagation. During the stress test, it was noticed that the largest blocks (~20 MB) could take minutes to propagate across the network. This is a serious concern since propagation delays mean increased orphan rates, which in turn complicate the economics and incentives of mining.
'Graphene' is a set reconciliation technique using bloom filters and invertible bloom lookup tables. It drastically reduces the amount of bandwidth required to communicate a block. Unfortunately, the core graphene mechanism does not provide ordering information, and so if many orderings are possible then ordering information needs to be appended. For large blocks, this ordering information makes up the majority of the graphene message.
To reduce the size of ordering information while keeping TTOR, miners could optionally decide to order their transactions in a canonical ordering (Gavin's order, for example) and the graphene protocol could be hard coded so that this kind of special order is transmitted in one byte. This would add a significant technical burden on mining software (to create blocks in such a specific unusual order) as well as graphene (which must detect this order, and be able to reconstruct it). It is not clear to me whether it would be possible to efficiently parallelize sorting algortithms that reconstruct these orderings.
The adoption of CTOR gives an easy solution to all this: there is only one ordering, so no extra ordering information needs to be appended. The ordering is recovered with a comparison sort, which parallelizes better than a topological sort. This should simplify the graphene codebase and it removes the need to start considering supporting various optional ordering encodings.

Reversibility and technical debt

Can the change to CTOR be undone at a later time? Yes and no.
For block validators / block explorers that look over historical blocks, the removal of TTOR will permanently rule out usage of the standard serial processing algorithm. This is not really a problem (aside from the one-time annoyance), since OTI appears to be just as efficient in serial, and it parallelizes well.
For anything that deals with new blocks (like graphene, network protocol, block builders for mining, new block validation), it is not a problem to change the ordering at a later date (to AOR / TTOR or back to CTOR again, or something else). These changes would add no long term technical debt, since they only involve new blocks. For past-block validation it can be retroactively declared that old blocks (older than a few months) have no ordering requirement.

Summary and outlook

Taking a broader view, graphene is not the magic bullet for network propagation. Even with the CTOR-improved graphene, we might not see vastly better performance right away. There is also work needed in the network layer to simply move the messages faster between nodes. In the last stress test, we also saw limitations on mempool performance (tx acceptance and relaying). I hope both of these fronts see optimizations before the next stress test, so that a fresh set of bottlenecks can be revealed.
submitted by markblundeberg to btc [link] [comments]

Some advice for everybody at this point in time

Hi all. I'm taking the liberty to share some hard-won experience at this point in time.

Some advice for Core and supporters

It's easy to feel resentment at this stage, having done so much work and written so much high-quality code, and yet getting a shitstorm for it. When I was leading the Swedish Pirate Party into the European Parliament, I was gradually getting used to getting a barrage of criticism grenades for everything I did and didn't do every single day, starting with when I did or didn't get out of bed in the morning.
It's very hard to explain what this does to your psyche to somebody who hasn't experienced it. Imagine everybody was out to get you, every single day, and giving you high-pitched screaming blame for everything from an orange being round to some Mongolian guy's utter misinterpretation of what you said three years ago.
I'm not exaggerating when I say that people could probably snap and go restraining-shirt-insane for much less.
But the crucial thing when you're in a leadership position like that, getting criticism for absolutely everything, is to maintain your ability to sort the relevant criticism apart from the back seat drivers who make a living out of complaining but not contributing. You've also got to trust your inner compass of the vision you want to accomplish.
From what I can tell, Core has made the common but crucial mistake of isolating itself from the community and taking on an expert attitude toward everybody else in trusting this inner vision compass over external criticism, where Core is somehow right by definition - the development happens as Core wants it, period. This is very dangerous in any open-source / free software project. Other people are just as intelligent and may have considerable experience and ability to evaluate the claims made, and these should - no, must - be taken seriously.
To illustrate just one point, let's take a look at Core's scaling solution here, Segregated Witness.
When I apply my nontrivial experience in coding and systems design - I started coding 37 years ago - I see these two options for scaling bitcoin near-term:
OPTION ONE - Change the blocksize upper limit to two megabytes. One line of code for the constant, about ten LOCs for activation trigger logic. Requires upgrading of a majority server software.
OPTION TWO - Introduce Segwit. About 500 lines of new code, of which at least 100 in the hypersensitive consensus code. Requires upgrading a majority of server software and all client/wallet software and client/wallet hardware, especially those needing to pay money to an arbitrary address (as Segwit introduces a new type of address).
When proponents of Core's scaling tell me that Option Two here is the better because it's safer, and I try to comprehend that statement, I am either utterly insane or the statement is the equivalent of "black is white and up is down". It's just not completely counter to all experience in software engineering risk management, it's so far out it doesn't reflect sunlight anymore.
When I try to understand more and challenge the assertion that option two is safer - on what I must say are very good grounds - I'm told that I should be leaving design to the experts and that I don't understand enough of the complex machine that is bitcoin. I know I am capable of learning complexities, but I am firmly told off from even trying.
That's just not how you succeed in maintaining a community. That's not how you make people want to run your code.
Of course, people are free to run whatever code they like. But the checks and balances in an open source community is simple: if the leadership for a project builds something different from what people want to run, they will run something else. It's therefore in the interest of the leadership to listen to the community to understand what software a majority wants to run. These competing interests provide the checks and balances.
Now, I understand the complexity of block transfer times through the Chinese firewall and that preliminary tests indicate that a typical full node is saturated at a blocksize of 32 megabytes. However, none of these limits will be hit by this particular scaling. Also, when blazing a trail like this, you work one problem at a time, you solve one bottleneck at a time. People have been flagging for the necessity of increasing the blocksize for ... I don't have dates here at hand, but it should be the better part of a year if not more. Further down the road, scaling node throughput capacity can be done in a number of ways from GPUing ECDSA to specialized hardware, but it's not the imminent bottleneck.
When such an enormous amount of crucial data (on the need to raise the blocksize limit) is ignored, that is done at the peril of the project.
People in the bitcoin community are intelligent geeks, capable of inhaling absurd amounts of information and cross-referencing all of it. If you are unable to explain why your solution is better than another proposed solution, people will be utterly dissatisfied with the response "because we are the experts" - for you must assume that other people in the community, in the general case, are at least as intelligent and capable of learning as you are. It's even possible that if you can't explain your solution to an open and intelligent mind, it's not a good solution.

Some advice for Classic and supporters

So it appears the hard fork is happening. A lot of people have fought hard to raise the blocksize limit for a long time, using a variety of means, and it seems to be happening at long last.
Core didn't take the last available opportunity to include a blocksize limit lift in 0.12, but have announced the release candidate without that feature. So this is it, this is when the fork happens or doesn't happen. Right now, based on announced support, the fork appears to be moving forward. A lot of people supporting Classic are feeling a lot of relief, even if people know that this effort is not done until the blocksize trigger has activated on the network. It's far from there at this point - there's not even deployed code. But everything seems to be going the right way.
It's important to reflect on how this is more than a discussion on features. This is an election of what people decide get to decide on the features, direction, quality, and vision moving forward. And as Satoshi declared, there's only one thing determining the outcome of the election: what code is producing the longest chain. That's how bitcoin's democracy works, right there.
This is not a selection of features. It's much bigger than that. It's an election of governance and stewardship into the future.
As in most elections, there has been a lot of animosity - in both directions. As heels have been dug in, ditches turned to trenches, and preferences turned into prestige, people are starting to call out each other and accuse the other side of not working for what's best for bitcoin, and actively naming specific names in negative contexts.
When those in power do this to you, you're feeling everything in the book between resentment, belittling, and outrage. It's easy to do the same thing back. There have even been suggestions that Core is deliberately sabotaging bitcoin to the benefit of ... a selection of actors.
This creates a toxic culture leading up to the election point, where people are afraid to take bitcoin-positive initiatives in anticipation of all the negative attention that follows - for in such an environment, practically all attention will be negative.
It doesn't help that people incumbent in positions of power tend to "do what they must, because they can" in order to safeguard the status quo, however small or insignificant that incumbency is - this includes everything from Theymos' deletion of discussions, via the silly DDoS attacks on XT nodes, to LukeJR's poison pull request to Classic about killing all miner hardware investment. Actions such as these are not really excusable, but they are still human: people tend to do the very human mistake of letting the ends justify the means, with the ends being what they believe is best for the bitcoin network.
Of course, other people disagree of what's best for the bitcoin network, and toxicity follows until the conflict is resolved. And beyond. The toxicity will remain until actively removed by leadership.
It is the responsibility of the winner in any rift to end a toxic animosity culture of hostilities and personal adversarialism. I cannot stress this enough.
History is full of examples where the winners refused to live alongside the losers and rebuild the world together once the conflict was resolved. It never ends well. On the other hand, where the opposite has been true - South Africa's end of segregation with Mandela as president comes to mind as a good example of leadership here - people learn to put animosity behind them.
A lot of people who have submitted code to Core (and previously) are skilled coders, after all, working from their vision. This vision doesn't have to be incompatible with Classic's vision in the slightest - it may just be a matter of slightly different feature priorities, with people intending to get everything in there anyway.
(I'd also therefore like to praise Jonathan Toomim for not engaging in the rifting but focusing on solving the problem to most people's acceptance. Real MVP right there.)

Finally, some personal reflections

Unfortunately, I believe bitcoin development has lost touch with large-scale rollout necessities over the past year or so. At the moment, there are three use cases which all new features should seek to improve:
Remittance. The act of sending money between individuals in different countries.
Drop-in credit card replacement, from the perspectives of both the payer and the merchant (two different use cases). This means that a payment must be instant, easy, and much cheaper than a credit card settlement.
These three use cases must be front left, right, and center when doing any design on the bitcoin network, as far as I'm concerned. They also reinforce each other when funds received by remittance don't have to go via fiat to be used for purchasing something.
If there's no profit to be made in using bitcoin as a drop-in replacement for credit card payments, bitcoin will not be deployed at scale. Deployment and outcompeting legacy systems depend entirely on merchant financial gains from rollout. The story begins and ends with this observation.
That's why I'm concerned when I'm looking at the features of 0.12. I don't see any features targeting one of these three use cases. Fact is, I see at least one feature severely degrading the drop-in capability of credit card replacement - RBF - and the lack of scaling severely jeopardizing, not to say ultimately removing, the profitability in replacing credit cards.
What I see is instead engineering for the sake of engineering. The question of "who's the customer?" seems to have gotten lost in the process. While it's arguable that there's no customer as such in an open source project, there's nevertheless an importance in understanding where the front bowling pins are for a disruptive technology like this - and it's certainly not in the one-time initialization time of starting up a new node. I'd argue that the front bowling pins instead are the three use cases I listed above, and would love to see a stronger focus on tangible use cases moving forward even if people disagree with my choice of cases.
Onward and upward. Bitcoin will recover and move on. Let's learn from this experience.
submitted by Falkvinge to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

Some advice for everybody at this point in time

Hi all. I'm taking the liberty to share some hard-won experience at this point in time.

Some advice for Classic and supporters

So it appears the hard fork is happening. A lot of people have fought hard to raise the blocksize limit for a long time, using a variety of means, and it seems to be happening at long last.
Core didn't take the last available opportunity to include a blocksize limit lift in 0.12, but have announced the release candidate without that feature. So this is it, this is when the fork happens or doesn't happen. Right now, based on announced support, the fork appears to be moving forward. A lot of people supporting Classic are feeling a lot of relief, even if people know that this effort is not done until the blocksize trigger has activated on the network. It's far from there at this point - there's not even deployed code. But everything seems to be going the right way.
It's important to reflect on how this is more than a discussion on features. This is an election of what people decide get to decide on the features, direction, quality, and vision moving forward. And as Satoshi declared, there's only one thing determining the outcome of the election: what code is producing the longest chain. That's how bitcoin's democracy works, right there.
This is not a selection of features. It's much bigger than that. It's an election of governance and stewardship into the future.
As in most elections, there has been a lot of animosity - in both directions. As heels have been dug in, ditches turned to trenches, and preferences turned into prestige, people are starting to call out each other and accuse the other side of not working for what's best for bitcoin, and actively naming specific names in negative contexts.
When those in power do this to you, you're feeling everything in the book between resentment, belittling, and outrage. It's easy to do the same thing back. There have even been suggestions that Core is deliberately sabotaging bitcoin to the benefit of ... a selection of actors.
This creates a toxic culture leading up to the election point, where people are afraid to take bitcoin-positive initiatives in anticipation of all the negative attention that follows - for in such an environment, practically all attention will be negative.
It doesn't help that people incumbent in positions of power tend to "do what they must, because they can" in order to safeguard the status quo, however small or insignificant that incumbency is - this includes everything from Theymos' deletion of discussions, via the silly DDoS attacks on XT nodes, to LukeJR's poison pull request to Classic about killing all miner hardware investment. Actions such as these are not really excusable, but they are still human: people tend to do the very human mistake of letting the ends justify the means, with the ends being what they believe is best for the bitcoin network.
Of course, other people disagree of what's best for the bitcoin network, and toxicity follows until the conflict is resolved. And beyond. The toxicity will remain until actively removed by leadership.
It is the responsibility of the winner in any rift to end a toxic animosity culture of hostilities and personal adversarialism. I cannot stress this enough.
History is full of examples where the winners refused to live alongside the losers and rebuild the world together once the conflict was resolved. It never ends well. On the other hand, where the opposite has been true - South Africa's end of segregation with Mandela as president comes to mind as a good example of leadership here - people learn to put animosity behind them.
There's a highly-upvoted thread already about keeping the moral high ground in /btc, which makes me happy. However, an effort like the one I'm describing goes beyond not behaving badly. The winning side must actively take responsibility for reconciliation.
A lot of people who have submitted code to Core (and previously) are skilled coders, after all, working from their vision. This vision doesn't have to be incompatible with Classic's vision in the slightest - it may just be a matter of slightly different feature priorities, with people intending to get everything in there anyway.
This assumes, of course, that the hard fork happens. We're not there yet. Do not take success for granted; many projects have fallen on taking success for granted.
(I'd also therefore like to praise Jonathan Toomim for not engaging in the rifting but focusing on solving the problem to most people's acceptance. Real MVP right there.)

Some advice for Core and supporters

It's easy to feel resentment at this stage, having done so much work and written so much high-quality code, and yet getting a shitstorm for it. When I was leading the Swedish Pirate Party into the European Parliament, I was gradually getting used to getting a barrage of criticism grenades for everything I did and didn't do every single day, starting with when I did or didn't get out of bed in the morning.
It's very hard to explain what this does to your psyche to somebody who hasn't experienced it. Imagine everybody was out to get you, every single day, and giving you high-pitched screaming blame for everything from an orange being round to some Mongolian guy's utter misinterpration of what you said three years ago.
I'm not exaggerating when I say that people could probably snap and go restraining-shirt-insane for much less.
But the crucial thing when you're in a leadership position like that, getting criticism for absolutely everything, is to maintain your ability to sort the relevant criticism apart from the back seat drivers who make a living out of complaining but not contributing. You've also got to trust your inner compass of the vision you want to accomplish.
From what I can tell, Core has made the common but crucial mistake of isolating itself from the community and taking on an expert attitude toward everybody else in trusting this inner vision compass over external criticism, where Core is somehow right by definition - the development happens as Core wants it, period. This is very dangerous in any open-source / free software project. Other people are just as intelligent and may have considerable experience and ability to evaluate the claims made, and these should - no, must - be taken seriously.
To illustrate just one point, let's take a look at Core's scaling solution here, Segregated Witness.
When I apply my nontrivial experience in coding and systems design - I started coding 37 years ago - I see these two options for scaling bitcoin near-term:
OPTION ONE - Change the blocksize upper limit to two megabytes. One line of code for the constant, about ten LOCs for activation trigger logic. Requires upgrading of a majority server software.
OPTION TWO - Introduce Segwit. About 500 lines of new code, of which at least 100 in the hypersensitive consensus code. Requires upgrading a majority of server software and all client/wallet software and client/wallet hardware, especially those needing to pay money to an arbitrary address (as Segwit introduces a new type of address that both sender and receiver must handle).
When proponents of Core's scaling tell me that Option Two here is the better because it's safer, and I try to comprehend that statement, I am either utterly insane or the statement is the equivalent of "black is white and up is down". It's just not completely counter to all experience in software engineering risk management, it's so far out it doesn't reflect sunlight anymore.
When I try to understand more and challenge the assertion that option two is safer - on what I must say are very good grounds - I'm told that I should be leaving design to the experts and that I don't understand enough of the complex machine that is bitcoin. I know I am capable of learning complexities, but I am firmly told off from even trying.
That's just not how you succeed in maintaining a community. That's not how you make people want to run your code.
Of course, people are free to run whatever code they like. But the checks and balances in an open source community is simple: if the leadership for a project builds something different from what people want to run, they will run something else. It's therefore in the interest of the leadership to listen to the community to understand what software a majority wants to run. These competing interests provide the checks and balances.
Now, I understand the complexity of block transfer times through the Chinese firewall and that preliminary tests indicate that a typical full node is saturated at a blocksize of 32 megabytes. However, none of these limits will be hit by this particular scaling. Also, when blazing a trail like this, you work one problem at a time, you solve one bottleneck at a time. People have been flagging for the necessity of increasing the blocksize for ... I don't have dates here at hand, but it should be the better part of a year if not more. Further down the road, scaling node throughput capacity can be done in a number of ways from GPUing ECDSA to specialized hardware, but it's not the imminent bottleneck.
When such an enormous amount of crucial data (on the need to raise the blocksize limit) is ignored, that is done at the peril of the project.
People in the bitcoin community are intelligent geeks, capable of inhaling absurd amounts of information and cross-referencing all of it. If you are unable to explain why your solution is better than another proposed solution, people will be utterly dissatisfied with the response "because we are the experts" - for you must assume that other people in the community, in the general case, are at least as intelligent and capable of learning as you are. It's even possible that if you can't explain your solution to an open and intelligent mind, it's not a good solution.

Finally, some personal reflections

Unfortunately, I believe bitcoin development has lost touch with large-scale rollout necessities over the past year or so. At the moment, there are three use cases which all new features should seek to improve:
Remittance. The act of sending money between individuals in different countries.
Drop-in credit card replacement, from the perspectives of both the payer and the merchant (two different use cases). This means that a payment must be instant, easy, and much cheaper than a credit card settlement.
These three use cases must be front left, right, and center when doing any design on the bitcoin network, as far as I'm concerned. They also reinforce each other when funds received by remittance don't have to go via fiat to be used for purchasing something.
If there's no profit to be made in using bitcoin as a drop-in replacement for credit card payments, bitcoin will not be deployed at scale. Deployment and outcompeting legacy systems depend entirely on merchant financial gains from rollout. The story begins and ends with this observation.
That's why I'm concerned when I'm looking at the features of 0.12. I don't see any features targeting one of these three use cases. Fact is, I see at least one feature severely degrading the drop-in capability of credit card replacement - RBF - and the lack of scaling severely jeopardizing, not to say ultimately removing, the profitability in replacing credit cards.
What I see is instead engineering for the sake of engineering. The question of "who's the customer?" seems to have gotten lost in the process. While it's arguable that there's no customer as such in an open source project, there's nevertheless an importance in understanding where the front bowling pins are for a disruptive technology like this - and it's certainly not in the one-time initialization time of starting up a new node. I'd argue that the front bowling pins instead are the three use cases I listed above, and would love to see a stronger focus on tangible use cases moving forward even if people disagree with my choice of cases.
Onward and upward. Bitcoin will recover and move on. Let's learn from this experience.
submitted by Falkvinge to btc [link] [comments]

P2Pool upgrade for segwit compatibility

In order for P2Pool to produce segwit blocks an upgrade is needed. Forrest Voight (forrestv), the P2Pool creator, has been inactive in the project for years so an unofficial upgrade is provided by me:
https://github.com/veqtrus/p2pool/releases/tag/16.1-segwit
GPG public key

Background

In a few days segwit is activating so every mining pool needs to upgrade. This also applies to P2Pool. With P2Pool though being a decentralized mining protocol this is more complex than simply updating your mining software as P2Pool forms its own blockchain, the "sharechain", which is used to track payouts to miners. Any change to how P2Pool works which affects the validity of each share, as is the case with any upgrade to the chain being mined i.e. Bitcoin, requires coordination from the majority of P2Pool miners.
Last year I posted a pull request to the main P2Pool repository with a patch to enable segwit compatibility. After testing on my part the patch was included in the Vertcoin P2Pool and has been working with great success making P2Pool among the largest Vertcoin pools. In fact after P2Pool's rise in popularity a second P2Pool network was introduced for smaller miners.
Meanwhile big block populist Jonathan Toomim (jtoomim) has made a P2Pool fork and increased the share size limit from 50 kB per 30 seconds to 1 MB. While an increase was reasonable and in fact I included one in the segwit patch (to 100 kB) before him the excessive increase on jtoomim's fork is compatible with the BU vision campaigned by him and contradicts the decentralized nature of P2Pool. Now jtoomim has merged my segwit patch and made it a requirement [edit: albeit it can be manually overriden] to use btc1 (segwit2x) misleading users that his fork is a segwit upgrade.
submitted by veqtrus to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

Subreddit Stats: btc posts from 2019-05-28 to 2019-06-07 10:40 PDT

Period: 10.34 days
Submissions Comments
Total 850 14116
Rate (per day) 82.22 1245.55
Unique Redditors 440 1828
Combined Score 26564 50495

Top Submitters' Top Submissions

  1. 3690 points, 33 submissions: MemoryDealers
    1. Brains..... (420 points, 94 comments)
    2. The first trade has already happened on Local.bitcoin.com! (193 points, 67 comments)
    3. China is already leading the way with the most trades done on local.bitcoin.com, followed by India. We really are helping free the world! (192 points, 58 comments)
    4. More than 100 BCH has been raised in just a few days to help support BCH protocol development! (180 points, 63 comments)
    5. The Bitcoin Cash Protocol Development Fund has already raised more than 10% of its goal from 467 separate transactions!!! (180 points, 58 comments)
    6. Local.bitcoin.com (159 points, 80 comments)
    7. The BCH miners are good guy heroes! (152 points, 161 comments)
    8. The Bitcoin.com YouTube channel just pased 25K subscribers (147 points, 19 comments)
    9. Ways to trigger a BTC maximalist: Remind them that because they didn't increase the block size, fees will eventually climb to dumb levels again. This will put brakes on it's bull trend, and funnel cash into alts instead. (141 points, 107 comments)
    10. Why more and more people are switching from BTC to BCH (137 points, 193 comments)
  2. 1561 points, 20 submissions: money78
    1. "Not a huge @rogerkver fan and never really used $BCH. But he wiped up the floor with @ToneVays in Malta, and even if you happen to despise BCH, it’s foolish and shortsighted not to take these criticisms seriously. $BTC is very expensive and very slow." (261 points, 131 comments)
    2. Jonathan Toomim: "At 32 MB, we can handle something like 30% of Venezuela's population using BCH 2x per day. Even if that's all BCH ever achieved, I'd call that a resounding success; that's 9 million people raised out of poverty. Not a bad accomplishment for a hundred thousand internet geeks." (253 points, 180 comments)
    3. CEO of CoinEx: "CoinEx already add SLP token solution support. The first SLP token will list on CoinEx Soon. Also welcome apply to list SLP tokens on CoinEx." (138 points, 18 comments)
    4. "While Ethereum smart contracts have a lot more functionality than those in Bitcoin Cash, with the upcoming CashScript we've tried to replicate a big part of the workflow, hopefully making it easier for developers to engage with both of these communities. Check it out 🚀" (120 points, 35 comments)
    5. Bitcoin ABC 0.19.7 is now available! This release includes RPC and wallet improvements, and a new transaction index database. See the release notes for details. (104 points, 5 comments)
    6. Vin Armani: "Huge shout out to the @BitcoinCom wallet team! I just heard from a very authoritative source that multi-output BIP 70 support has been successfully tested and will be in a near-term future release. Now, the most popular BCH wallet will support Non-Custodial Financial Services!" (88 points, 23 comments)
    7. BSV folks: Anything legal is good...We want our coin to be legal! (79 points, 66 comments)
    8. BCH fees vs BTC fees (78 points, 85 comments)
    9. "This @CashShuffle on BCH looks awesome. The larger blocksize on BCH allows for cheap on-chain transactions. @CashShuffle leverages this in a very creative way to gain privacy. Ignoring the tribalism, it's fascinating to watch BCH vs. BTC compete in the marketplace." (77 points, 3 comments)
    10. Bitcoin Cash the best that bitcoin can be...🔥💪 (60 points, 9 comments)
  3. 1413 points, 18 submissions: Egon_1
    1. "The claim “Bitcoin was purpose-built to first be a Store of Value” is false. In this article I've posting every single instance I could find across everything Satoshi ever wrote related to store of value or payments. It wasn't even close. Payments win." (299 points, 82 comments)
    2. The Art of Rewriting History ... File this under Deception! (184 points, 69 comments)
    3. Today's Next Block Fee: BTC ($3.55) and BCH ($0.00). Enjoy! (120 points, 101 comments)
    4. Andreas Brekken: "The maxi thought leaders have a ⚡in their username but can't describe a bidirectional payment channel. Ask questions? They attack you until you submit or leave. Leave? You're a scammer....." (115 points, 11 comments)
    5. Tone Vays: "So I will admit, I did terrible in the Malta Debate vs @rogerkver [...]" (107 points, 95 comments)
    6. This Week in Bitcoin Cash (96 points, 10 comments)
    7. “There was no way to win that debate. Roger came armed with too much logic and facts.” (78 points, 1 comment)
    8. BTC supporter enters a coffee shop: "I like to pay $3 premium security fee for my $4 coffee ☕️" (64 points, 100 comments)
    9. Matt Corallo: "... the worst parts of Bitcoin culture reliably come from folks like @Excellion and a few of the folks he has hired at @Blockstream ..." (63 points, 43 comments)
    10. Angela Walch: "Is there a resource that keeps an up-to-date list of those who have commit access to the Bitcoin Core Github repo & who pays them for their work on Bitcoin? In the past, getting this info has required digging. Is that still the case? " (57 points, 5 comments)
  4. 852 points, 11 submissions: jessquit
    1. PSA: BTC not working so great? Bitcoin upgraded in 2017. The upgraded Bitcoin is called BCH. There's still time to upgrade! (185 points, 193 comments)
    2. Nobody uses Bitcoin Cash (178 points, 89 comments)
    3. Yes, Bitcoin was always supposed to be gold 2.0: digital gold that you could use like cash, so you could spend it anywhere without needing banks and gold notes to make it useful. So why is Core trying to turn it back into gold 1.0? (112 points, 85 comments)
    4. This interesting conversation between Jonathan Toomim and @_drgo where jtoomim explains how large blocks actually aren't a centralization driver (89 points, 36 comments)
    5. This Twitter conversation between Jonathan Toomim and Adam Back is worth a read (75 points, 15 comments)
    6. In October 2010 Satoshi proposed a hard fork block size upgrade. This proposed upgrade was a fundamental factor in many people's decision to invest, myself included. BCH implemented this upgrade. BTC did not. (74 points, 41 comments)
    7. what do the following have in common: Australia, Canada, USA, Hong Kong, Jamaica, Liberia, Namibia, New Zealand, Singapore, Taiwan, Caribbean Netherlands, East Timor, Ecuador, El Salvador, the Federated States of Micronesia, the Marshall Islands, Palau, Zimbabwe (47 points, 20 comments)
    8. Core myth dispelled: how Bitcoin offers sovereignty (45 points, 65 comments)
    9. Satoshi's Speedbump: how Bitcoin's goldlike scarcity helps address scaling worries (25 points, 9 comments)
    10. Greater Fool Theory (14 points, 13 comments)
  5. 795 points, 7 submissions: BitcoinXio
    1. Erik Voorhees on Twitter: “I wonder if you realize that if Bitcoin didn’t work well as a payment system in the early days it likely would not have taken off. Many (most?) people found the concept of instant borderless payments captivating and inspiring. “Just hold this stuff” not sufficient.” (297 points, 68 comments)
    2. On Twitter: “PSA: The Lightning Network is being heavily data mined right now. Opening channels allows anyone to cluster your wallet and associate your keys with your IP address.” (226 points, 102 comments)
    3. Shocking (not): Blockstream has had a hard time getting business due to their very bad reputation (73 points, 25 comments)
    4. While @PeterMcCormack experiments with his #LightningNetwork bank, waiting over 20 seconds to make a payment, real P2P #Bitcoin payments have already arrived on #BitcoinCash. (66 points, 94 comments)
    5. This is what we’re up against. Mindless sheep being brain washed and pumping Bitcoin (BTC) as gold to try to make a buck. (56 points, 29 comments)
    6. Tuur Demeester: “At full maturity, using the Bitcoin blockchain will be as rare and specialized as chartering an oil tanker.” (54 points, 61 comments)
    7. ‪Bitcoin Cash 101: What Happens When We Decentralize Money? ‬ (23 points, 2 comments)
  6. 720 points, 2 submissions: InMyDayTVwasBooks
    1. A Reminder Why You Shouldn’t Use Google. (619 points, 214 comments)
    2. 15 Years Ago VS. Today: How Tech Scales (101 points, 53 comments)
  7. 485 points, 15 submissions: JonyRotten
    1. Cashscript Is Coming, Bringing Ethereum-Like Smart Contracts to Bitcoin Cash (96 points, 6 comments)
    2. Localbitcoins Removes In-Person Cash Trades Forcing Traders to Look Elsewhere (86 points, 26 comments)
    3. Bitcoin.com's Local Bitcoin Cash Marketplace Is Now Open for Trading (48 points, 22 comments)
    4. Report Insists 'Bitcoin Was Not Purpose-Built to First Be a Store of Value' (48 points, 8 comments)
    5. BCH Businesses Launch Development Fund for Bitcoin Cash (36 points, 1 comment)
    6. Another Aspiring Satoshi Copyrights the Bitcoin Whitepaper (31 points, 0 comments)
    7. Bitcoin Cash and SLP-Fueled Badger Wallet Launches for iOS (27 points, 0 comments)
    8. Bitcoin Mining With Solar: Less Risky and More Profitable Than Selling to the Grid (26 points, 0 comments)
    9. Former Mt Gox CEO Mark Karpeles Announces New Blockchain Startup (25 points, 25 comments)
    10. Mixing Service Bitcoin Blender Quits After Bestmixer Takedown (23 points, 7 comments)
  8. 426 points, 2 submissions: btcCore_isnt_Bitcoin
    1. Ponder the power of propaganda, Samson Mow, Adam Back and Greg Maxwell all know how import control of bitcoin is. (394 points, 98 comments)
    2. How many Bitcoin Core supporters does it take to change a light bulb? (32 points, 35 comments)
  9. 369 points, 3 submissions: where-is-satoshi
    1. Currently you must buy 11,450 coffees on a single Lightning channel to match the payment efficiency of Bitcoin BCH - you will also need to open an LN channel with at least $47,866 (230 points, 173 comments)
    2. North Queensland's Beauty Spot finds Bitcoin BCH a thing of beauty (74 points, 6 comments)
    3. Can't start the day without a BCHinno (65 points, 9 comments)
  10. 334 points, 5 submissions: AD1AD
    1. You Can Now Send Bitcoin Cash to Mobile Phones in Electron Cash Using Cointext! (132 points, 32 comments)
    2. Merchants are Dropping Multi-Coin PoS for One Cryptocurrency: Bitcoin Cash (73 points, 21 comments)
    3. A Stellar Animated Video from CoinSpice Explaining how CashShuffle Works Under the Hood! (67 points, 10 comments)
    4. If you haven't seen the "Shit Bitcoin Cash Fanatics Say" videos from Scott Rose (The Inspirational Nerd), YOU NEED TO DO IT NOWWW (50 points, 7 comments)
    5. New Video from Bitcoin Out Loud: "Can You Store Data on the Bitcoin Blockchain?" (Spoiler: Not really.) (12 points, 10 comments)
  11. 332 points, 6 submissions: eyeofpython
    1. I believe the BCH denomination is the best (in contrast to bits, cash and sats), if used with eight digits & spaces: 0.001 234 00 BCH. This way both the BCH and the satoshi amount is immediately clear. Once the value of a satoshi gets close to 1¢, the dot can simply be dropped. (112 points, 41 comments)
    2. Only after writing more BCH Script I realized how insanely usefull all the new opcodes are — CDS and those activated/added back in May '18. Kudos to the developers! (104 points, 22 comments)
    3. CashProof is aready so awesome it can formally prove all optimizations Spedn uses, except one. Great news for BCH smart contracts! (51 points, 6 comments)
    4. Proposal for a new opcode: OP_REVERSE (43 points, 55 comments)
    5. My response on your guy's critisism of OP_REVERSE and the question of why the SLP protocol (and others) don't simply switch to little endian (20 points, 25 comments)
    6. random post about quantum physics (both relevant and irrelevant for Bitcoin at the same time) (2 points, 11 comments)
  12. 322 points, 6 submissions: unitedstatian
    1. BCH is victim to one of the biggest manipulation campaigns in social media: Any mention of BCH triggered users instantly to spam "BCASH".. until BSV which is a BCH fork and almost identical to it pre-November fork popped out of nowhere and suddenly social media is spammed with pro-BSV posts. (131 points, 138 comments)
    2. LocalBitcoins just banned cash. It really only goes to show everything in the BTC ecosystem is compromised. (122 points, 42 comments)
    3. The new narrative of the shills who moved to promoting bsv: Bitcoin was meant to be government-friendly (33 points, 138 comments)
    4. Hearn may have been the only sober guy around (21 points, 29 comments)
    5. PSA: The economical model of the Lightning Network is unsound. The LN will support different coins which will be interconnected and since the LN tokens will be transacted instead of the base coins backing them up their value will be eroded over time. (14 points, 8 comments)
    6. DARPA-Funded Study Looks at How Crypto Chats Spread on Reddit (1 point, 0 comments)
  13. 313 points, 8 submissions: CreativeName44
    1. Venezuela Hidden Bitcoin Cash paper wallet claimed with 0.17468 BCH! Congrats to the one who found it! (80 points, 0 comments)
    2. Alright BCH Redditors, Let's make some HUGE noise!! Announcing The NBA finals Toronto Raptors Hidden BCH Wallet!! (60 points, 9 comments)
    3. FindBitcoinCash gaining traction around the world - Calling out to Bitcoin Cashers to join the fun!! (41 points, 0 comments)
    4. The Toronto Raptors Bitcoin Cash Wallet has been hidden: Address qz72j9e906g7pes769yp8d4ltdmh4ajl9vf76pj0v9 (PLS RT - Some local media tagged on it) (39 points, 0 comments)
    5. This is the next BitcoinCash wallet that is going to be hidden, hopefully REALLY soon! (36 points, 13 comments)
    6. Bitcoin Cash Meetups From Around the World added to FindBitcoinCash (25 points, 0 comments)
    7. FindBitcoinCash Wallets in other languages English/Spanish/Lithuanian/Swedish/Korean (20 points, 18 comments)
    8. Thank you for a great article!! (12 points, 0 comments)
  14. 312 points, 1 submission: scriberrr
    1. WHY? (312 points, 49 comments)
  15. 311 points, 4 submissions: Anenome5
    1. Libertarian sub GoldandBlack is hosting a free, live online workshop about how to setup and use Electron Cash on Sat 1st June via discord, including how to use Cashshuffle, with a Q&A session to follow. All are invited! (119 points, 40 comments)
    2. For anyone who still hasn't seen this, here is Peter Rizun and Andrew Stone presenting their research on how to do 1 gigabyte blocks, all the way back in 2017 at the Scaling Bitcoin Conference. The BTC camp has known we can scale bitcoin on-chain for years, they just don't want to hear it. (92 points, 113 comments)
    3. @ the trolls saying "No one uses Bitcoin Cash", let's look at the last 60 blocks... (72 points, 84 comments)
    4. Research Reveals Feasibility of 1TB Blocks, 7M Transactions per Second (28 points, 22 comments)
  16. 293 points, 2 submissions: BeijingBitcoins
    1. /Bitcoin mods are censoring posts that explain why BitPay has to charge an additional fee when accepting BTC payments (216 points, 110 comments)
    2. Meetups and adoption don't just happen organically, but are the result of the hard work of passionate community members. There are many others out there but these girls deserve some recognition! (77 points, 9 comments)
  17. 282 points, 1 submission: EddieFrmDaBlockchain
    1. LEAKED: Attendee List for Buffet Charity Lunch (282 points, 98 comments)
  18. 273 points, 4 submissions: HostFat
    1. Breakdown of all Satoshi’s Writings Proves Bitcoin not Built Primarily as Store of Value (159 points, 64 comments)
    2. Just to remember - When you are afraid that the market can go against you, use the state force. (48 points, 5 comments)
    3. CypherPoker.JS v0.5.0 - P2P Poker - Bitcoin Cash support added! (35 points, 3 comments)
    4. Feature request as standard for all bch mobile wallets (31 points, 12 comments)
  19. 262 points, 3 submissions: CaptainPatent
    1. Lightning Network capacity takes a sudden dive well below 1k BTC after passing that mark back in March. (97 points, 149 comments)
    2. Yeah, how is it fair that Bitpay is willing to eat a $0.0007 transaction fee and not a $2+ transaction fee?! (89 points, 59 comments)
    3. BTC Fees amplified today by last night's difficulty adjustment. Current (peak of day) next-block fees are testing new highs. (76 points, 59 comments)
  20. 262 points, 1 submission: Badrush
    1. Now I understand why Bitcoin Developers hate on-chain solutions like increasing block sizes. (262 points, 100 comments)

Top Commenters

  1. jessquit (2337 points, 242 comments)
  2. LovelyDay (1191 points, 160 comments)
  3. Ant-n (1062 points, 262 comments)
  4. MemoryDealers (977 points, 62 comments)
  5. jtoomim (880 points, 108 comments)
  6. 500239 (841 points, 142 comments)
  7. jonald_fyookball (682 points, 86 comments)
  8. ShadowOfHarbringer (672 points, 110 comments)
  9. money78 (660 points, 41 comments)
  10. playfulexistence (632 points, 76 comments)
  11. Bagatell_ (586 points, 72 comments)
  12. Big_Bubbler (552 points, 196 comments)
  13. homopit (551 points, 79 comments)
  14. Anenome5 (543 points, 130 comments)
  15. WippleDippleDoo (537 points, 111 comments)
  16. MobTwo (530 points, 52 comments)
  17. FalltheBanks3301 (483 points, 87 comments)
  18. btcfork (442 points, 115 comments)
  19. chainxor (428 points, 71 comments)
  20. eyeofpython (425 points, 78 comments)

Top Submissions

  1. A Reminder Why You Shouldn’t Use Google. by InMyDayTVwasBooks (619 points, 214 comments)
  2. Brains..... by MemoryDealers (420 points, 94 comments)
  3. Ponder the power of propaganda, Samson Mow, Adam Back and Greg Maxwell all know how import control of bitcoin is. by btcCore_isnt_Bitcoin (394 points, 98 comments)
  4. WHY? by scriberrr (312 points, 49 comments)
  5. "The claim “Bitcoin was purpose-built to first be a Store of Value” is false. In this article I've posting every single instance I could find across everything Satoshi ever wrote related to store of value or payments. It wasn't even close. Payments win." by Egon_1 (299 points, 82 comments)
  6. Erik Voorhees on Twitter: “I wonder if you realize that if Bitcoin didn’t work well as a payment system in the early days it likely would not have taken off. Many (most?) people found the concept of instant borderless payments captivating and inspiring. “Just hold this stuff” not sufficient.” by BitcoinXio (297 points, 68 comments)
  7. LEAKED: Attendee List for Buffet Charity Lunch by EddieFrmDaBlockchain (282 points, 98 comments)
  8. Now I understand why Bitcoin Developers hate on-chain solutions like increasing block sizes. by Badrush (262 points, 100 comments)
  9. "Not a huge @rogerkver fan and never really used $BCH. But he wiped up the floor with @ToneVays in Malta, and even if you happen to despise BCH, it’s foolish and shortsighted not to take these criticisms seriously. $BTC is very expensive and very slow." by money78 (261 points, 131 comments)
  10. Jonathan Toomim: "At 32 MB, we can handle something like 30% of Venezuela's population using BCH 2x per day. Even if that's all BCH ever achieved, I'd call that a resounding success; that's 9 million people raised out of poverty. Not a bad accomplishment for a hundred thousand internet geeks." by money78 (253 points, 180 comments)

Top Comments

  1. 109 points: mossmoon's comment in Now I understand why Bitcoin Developers hate on-chain solutions like increasing block sizes.
  2. 104 points: _degenerategambler's comment in Nobody uses Bitcoin Cash
  3. 96 points: FreelanceForCoins's comment in A Reminder Why You Shouldn’t Use Google.
  4. 94 points: ThomasZander's comment in "Not a huge @rogerkver fan and never really used $BCH. But he wiped up the floor with @ToneVays in Malta, and even if you happen to despise BCH, it’s foolish and shortsighted not to take these criticisms seriously. $BTC is very expensive and very slow."
  5. 91 points: cryptotrillionaire's comment in The Art of Rewriting History ... File this under Deception!
  6. 87 points: tjonak's comment in A Reminder Why You Shouldn’t Use Google.
  7. 86 points: money78's comment in Tone Vays: "So I will admit, I did terrible in the Malta Debate vs @rogerkver [...]"
  8. 83 points: discoltk's comment in "Not a huge @rogerkver fan and never really used $BCH. But he wiped up the floor with @ToneVays in Malta, and even if you happen to despise BCH, it’s foolish and shortsighted not to take these criticisms seriously. $BTC is very expensive and very slow."
  9. 79 points: jessquit's comment in Ways to trigger a Shitcoin influencer Part 1: Remind them that’s it’s very likely they got paid to shill fake Bitcoin to Noobs
  10. 78 points: PaladinInc's comment in The BCH miners are good guy heroes!
Generated with BBoe's Subreddit Stats
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Greg Maxwell /u/nullc (CTO of Blockstream) has sent me two private messages in response to my other post today (where I said "Chinese miners can only win big by following the market - not by following Core/Blockstream."). In response to his private messages, I am publicly posting my reply, here:

Note:
Greg Maxell nullc sent me 2 short private messages criticizing me today. For whatever reason, he seems to prefer messaging me privately these days, rather than responding publicly on these forums.
Without asking him for permission to publish his private messages, I do think it should be fine for me to respond to them publicly here - only quoting 3 phrases from them, namely: "340GB", "paid off", and "integrity" LOL.
There was nothing particularly new or revealing in his messages - just more of the same stuff we've all heard before. I have no idea why he prefers responding to me privately these days.
Everything below is written by me - I haven't tried to upload his 2 PMs to me, since he didn't give permission (and I didn't ask). The only stuff below from his 2 PMs is the 3 phrases already mentioned: "340GB", "paid off", and "integrity". The rest of this long wall of text is just my "open letter to Greg."
TL;DR: The code that maximally uses the available hardware and infrastructure will win - and there is nothing Core/Blockstream can do to stop that. Also, things like the Berlin Wall or the Soviet Union lasted for a lot longer than people expected - but, conversely, the also got swept away a lot faster than anyone expected. The "vote" for bigger blocks is an ongoing referendum - and Classic is running on 20-25% of the network (and can and will jump up to the needed 75% very fast, when investors demand it due to the inevitable "congestion crisis") - which must be a massive worry for Greg/Adam/Austin and their backers from the Bilderberg Group. The debate will inevitably be decided in favor of bigger blocks - simply because the market demands it, and the hardware / infrastructure supports it.
Hello Greg Maxwell nullc (CTO of Blockstream) -
Thank you for your private messages in response to my post.
I respect (most of) your work on Bitcoin, but I think you were wrong on several major points in your messages, and in your overall economic approach to Bitcoin - as I explain in greater detail below:
Correcting some inappropriate terminology you used
As everybody knows, Classic or Unlimited or Adaptive (all of which I did mention specifically in my post) do not support "340GB" blocks (which I did not mention in my post).
It is therefore a straw-man for you to claim that big-block supporters want "340GB" blocks. Craig Wright may want that - but nobody else supports his crazy posturing and ridiculous ideas.
You should know that what actual users / investors (and Satoshi) actually do want, is to let the market and the infrastructure decide on the size of actual blocks - which could be around 2 MB, or 4 MB, etc. - gradually growing in accordance with market needs and infrastructure capabilities (free from any arbitrary, artificial central planning and obstructionism on the part of Core/Blockstream, and its investors - many of whom have a vested interest in maintaining the current debt-backed fiat system).
You yourself (nullc) once said somewhere that bigger blocks would probably be fine - ie, they would not pose a decentralization risk. (I can't find the link now - maybe I'll have time to look for it later.) I found the link:
https://np.reddit.com/btc/comments/43mond/even_a_year_ago_i_said_i_though_we_could_probably/
I am also surprised that you now seem to be among those making unfounded insinuations that posters such as myself must somehow be "paid off" - as if intelligent observers and participants could not decide on their own, based on the empirical evidence, that bigger blocks are needed, when the network is obviously becoming congested and additional infrastructure is obviously available.
Random posters on Reddit might say and believe such conspiratorial nonsense - but I had always thought that you, given your intellectual abilities, would have been able to determine that people like me are able to arrive at supporting bigger blocks quite entirely on our own, based on two simple empirical facts, ie:
  • the infrastructure supports bigger blocks now;
  • the market needs bigger blocks now.
In the present case, I will simply assume that you might be having a bad day, for you to erroneously and groundlessly insinuate that I must be "paid off" in order to support bigger blocks.
Using Occam's Razor
The much simpler explanation is that bigger-block supporters believe will get "paid off" from bigger gains for their investment in Bitcoin.
Rational investors and users understand that bigger blocks are necessary, based on the apparent correlation (not necessarily causation!) between volume and price (as mentioned in my other post, and backed up with graphs).
And rational network capacity planners (a group which you should be in - but for some mysterious reason, you're not) also understand that bigger blocks are necessary, and quite feasible (and do not pose any undue "centralization risk".)
As I have been on the record for months publicly stating, I understand that bigger blocks are necessary based on the following two objective, rational reasons:
  • because I've seen the graphs; and
  • because I've seen the empirical research in the field (from guys like Gavin and Toomim) showing that the network infrastructure (primarily bandwidth and latency - but also RAM and CPU) would also support bigger blocks now (I believe they showed that 3-4MB blocks would definitely work fine on the network now - possibly even 8 MB - without causing undue centralization).
Bigger-block supporters are being objective; smaller-block supporters are not
I am surprised that you no longer talk about this debate in those kind of objective terms:
  • bandwidth, latency (including Great Firewall of China), RAM, CPU;
  • centralization risk
Those are really the only considerations which we should be discussing in this debate - because those are the only rational considerations which might justify the argument for keeping 1 MB.
And yet you, and Adam Back adam3us, and your company Blockstream (financed by the Bilderberg Group, which has significant overlap with central banks and the legacy, debt-based, violence-backed fiat money system that has been running and slowing destroying our world) never make such objective, technical arguments anymore.
And when you make unfounded conspiratorial, insulting insinuations saying people who disagree with you on the facts must somehow be "paid off", then you are now talking like some "nobody" on Reddit - making wild baseless accusations that people must be "paid off" to support bigger blocks, something I had always thought was "beneath" you.
Instead, Occams's Razor suggests that people who support bigger blocks are merely doing so out of:
  • simple, rational investment policy; and
  • simple, rational capacity planning.
At this point, the burden is on guys like you (nullc) to explain why you support a so-called scaling "roadmap" which is not aligned with:
  • simple, rational investment policy; and
  • simple, rational capacity planning
The burden is also on guys like you to show that you do not have a conflict of interest, due to Blockstream's highly-publicized connections (via insurance giant AXA - whose CED is also the Chairman of the Bilderberg Group; and companies such as the "Big 4" accounting firm PwC) to the global cartel of debt-based central banks with their infinite money-printing.
In a nutshell, the argument of big-block supporters is simple:
If the hardware / network infrastructure supports bigger blocks (and it does), and if the market demands it (and it does), then we certainly should use bigger blocks - now.
You have never provided a counter-argument to this simple, rational proposition - for the past few years.
If you have actual numbers or evidence or facts or even legitimate concerns (regarding "centralization risk" - presumably your only argument) then you should show such evidence.
But you never have. So we can only assume either incompetence or malfeasance on your part.
As I have also publicly and privately stated to you many times, with the utmost of sincerity: We do of course appreciate the wealth of stellar coding skills which you bring to Bitcoin's cryptographic and networking aspects.
But we do not appreciate the obstructionism and centralization which you also bring to Bitcoin's economic and scaling aspects.
Bitcoin is bigger than you.
The simple reality is this: If you can't / won't let Bitcoin grow naturally, then the market is going to eventually route around you, and billions (eventually trillions) of investor capital and user payments will naturally flow elsewhere.
So: You can either be the guy who wrote the software to provide simple and safe Bitcoin scaling (while maintaining "reasonable" decentralization) - or the guy who didn't.
The choice is yours.
The market, and history, don't really care about:
  • which "side" you (nullc) might be on, or
  • whether you yourself might have been "paid off" (or under a non-disclosure agreement written perhaps by some investors associated the Bilderberg Group and the legacy debt-based fiat money system which they support), or
  • whether or not you might be clueless about economics.
Crypto and/or Bitcoin will move on - with or without you and your obstructionism.
Bigger-block supporters, including myself, are impartial
By the way, my two recent posts this past week on the Craig Wright extravaganza...
...should have given you some indication that I am being impartial and objective, and I do have "integrity" (and I am not "paid off" by anybody, as you so insultingly insinuated).
In other words, much like the market and investors, I don't care who provides bigger blocks - whether it would be Core/Blockstream, or Bitcoin Classic, or (the perhaps confusingly-named) "Bitcoin Unlimited" (which isn't necessarily about some kind of "unlimited" blocksize, but rather simply about liberating users and miners from being "limited" by controls imposed by any centralized group of developers, such as Core/Blockstream and the Bilderbergers who fund you).
So, it should be clear by now I don't care one way or the other about Gavin personally - or about you, or about any other coders.
I care about code, and arguments - regardless of who is providing such things - eg:
  • When Gavin didn't demand crypto proof from Craig, and you said you would have: I publicly criticized Gavin - and I supported you.
  • When you continue to impose needless obstactles to bigger blocks, then I continue to criticize you.
In other words, as we all know, it's not about the people.
It's about the code - and what the market wants, and what the infrastructure will bear.
You of all people should know that that's how these things should be decided.
Fortunately, we can take what we need, and throw away the rest.
Your crypto/networking expertise is appreciated; your dictating of economic parameters is not.
As I have also repeatedly stated in the past, I pretty much support everything coming from you, nullc:
  • your crypto and networking and game-theoretical expertise,
  • your extremely important work on Confidential Transactions / homomorphic encryption.
  • your desire to keep Bitcoin decentralized.
And I (and the network, and the market/investors) will always thank you profusely and quite sincerely for these massive contributions which you make.
But open-source code is (fortunately) à la carte. It's mix-and-match. We can use your crypto and networking code (which is great) - and we can reject your cripple-code (artificially small 1 MB blocks), throwing it where it belongs: in the garbage heap of history.
So I hope you see that I am being rational and objective about what I support (the code) - and that I am also always neutral and impartial regarding who may (or may not) provide it.
And by the way: Bitcoin is actually not as complicated as certain people make it out to be.
This is another point which might be lost on certain people, including:
And that point is this:
The crypto code behind Bitcoin actually is very simple.
And the networking code behind Bitcoin is actually also fairly simple as well.
Right now you may be feeling rather important and special, because you're part of the first wave of development of cryptocurrencies.
But if the cryptocurrency which you're coding (Core/Blockstream's version of Bitcoin, as funded by the Bilderberg Group) fails to deliver what investors want, then investors will dump you so fast your head will spin.
Investors care about money, not code.
So bigger blocks will eventually, inevitably come - simply because the market demand is there, and the infrastructure capacity is there.
It might be nice if bigger blocks would come from Core/Blockstream.
But who knows - it might actually be nicer (in terms of anti-fragility and decentralization of development) if bigger blocks were to come from someone other than Core/Blockstream.
So I'm really not begging you - I'm warning you, for your own benefit (your reputation and place in history), that:
Either way, we are going to get bigger blocks.
Simply because the market wants them, and the hardware / infrastructre can provide them.
And there is nothing you can do to stop us.
So the market will inevitably adopt bigger blocks either with or without you guys - given that the crypto and networking tech behind Bitcoin is not all that complex, and it's open-source, and there is massive pent-up investor demand for cryptocurrency - to the tune of multiple billions (or eventually trillions) of dollars.
It ain't over till the fat lady sings.
Regarding the "success" which certain small-block supports are (prematurely) gloating about, during this time when a hard-fork has not happened yet: they should bear in mind that the market has only begun to speak.
And the first thing it did when it spoke was to dump about 20-25% of Core/Blockstream nodes in a matter of weeks. (And the next thing it did was Gemini added Ethereum trading.)
So a sizable percentage of nodes are already using Classic. Despite desperate, irrelevant attempts of certain posters on these forums to "spin" the current situation as a "win" for Core - it is actually a major "fail" for Core.
Because if Core/Blocksteam were not "blocking" Bitcoin's natural, organic growth with that crappy little line of temporary anti-spam kludge-code which you and your minions have refused to delete despite Satoshi explicitly telling you to back in 2010 ("MAX_BLOCKSIZE = 1000000"), then there would be something close to 0% nodes running Classic - not 25% (and many more addable at the drop of a hat).
This vote is ongoing.
This "voting" is not like a normal vote in a national election, which is over in one day.
Unfortunately for Core/Blockstream, the "voting" for Classic and against Core is actually two-year-long referendum.
It is still ongoing, and it can rapidly swing in favor of Classic at any time between now and Classic's install-by date (around January 1, 2018 I believe) - at any point when the market decides that it needs and wants bigger blocks (ie, due to a congestion crisis).
You know this, Adam Back knows this, Austin Hill knows this, and some of your brainwashed supporters on censored forums probably know this too.
This is probably the main reason why you're all so freaked out and feel the need to even respond to us unwashed bigger-block supporters, instead of simply ignoring us.
This is probably the main reason why Adam Back feels the need to keep flying around the world, holding meetings with miners, making PowerPoint presentations in English and Chinese, and possibly also making secret deals behind the scenes.
This is also why Theymos feels the need to censor.
And this is perhaps also why your brainwashed supporters from censored forums feel the need to constantly make their juvenile, content-free, drive-by comments (and perhaps also why you evidently feel the need to privately message me your own comments now).
Because, once again, for the umpteenth time in years, you've seen that we are not going away.
Every day you get another worrisome, painful reminder from us that Classic is still running on 25% of "your" network.
And everyday get another worrisome, painful reminder that Classic could easily jump to 75% in a matter of days - as soon as investors see their $7 billion wealth starting to evaporate when the network goes into a congestion crisis due to your obstructionism and insistence on artificially small 1 MB blocks.
If your code were good enough to stand on its own, then all of Core's globetrotting and campaigning and censorship would be necessary.
But you know, and everyone else knows, that your cripple-code does not include simple and safe scaling - and the competing code (Classic, Unlimited) does.
So your code cannot stand on its own - and that's why you and your supporters feel that it's necessary to keep up the censorship and and the lies and the snark. It's shameful that a smart coder like you would be involved with such tactics.
Oppressive regimes always last longer than everyone expects - but they also also collapse faster than anyone expects.
We already have interesting historical precedents showing how grassroots resistance to centralized oppression and obstructionism tends to work out in the end. The phenomenon is two-fold:
  • The oppression usually drags on much longer than anyone expects; and
  • The liberation usually happens quite abruptly - much faster than anyone expects.
The Berlin Wall stayed up much longer than everyone expected - but it also came tumbling down much faster than everyone expected.
Examples of opporessive regimes that held on surprisingly long, and collapsed surpisingly fast, are rather common - eg, the collapse of the Berlin Wall, or the collapse of the Soviet Union.
(Both examples are actually quite germane to the case of Blockstream/Core/Theymos - as those despotic regimes were also held together by the fragile chewing gum and paper clips of denialism and censorship, and the brainwashed but ultimately complacent and fragile yes-men that inevitably arise in such an environment.)
The Berlin Wall did indeed seem like it would never come down. But the grassroots resistance against it was always there, in the wings, chipping away at the oppression, trying to break free.
And then when it did come down, it happened in a matter of days - much faster than anyone had expected.
That's generally how these things tend to go:
  • oppression and obstructionism drag on forever, and the people oppressing freedom and progress erroneously believe that Core/Blockstream is "winning" (in this case: Blockstream/Core and you and Adam and Austin - and the clueless yes-men on censored forums like r\bitcoin who mindlessly support you, and the obedient Chinese miners who, thus far, have apparently been to polite to oppose you) ;
  • then one fine day, the market (or society) mysteriously and abruptly decides one day that "enough is enough" - and the tsunami comes in and washes the oppressors away in the blink of an eye.
So all these non-entities with their drive-by comments on these threads and their premature gloating and triumphalism are irrelevant in the long term.
The only thing that really matters is investors and users - who are continually applying grassroots pressure on the network, demanding increased capacity to keep the transactions flowing (and the price rising).
And then one day: the Berlin Wall comes tumbling down - or in the case of Bitcoin: a bunch of mining pools have to switch to Classic, and they will do switch so fast it will make your head spin.
Because there will be an emergency congestion crisis where the network is causing the price to crash and threatening to destroy $7 billion in investor wealth.
So it is understandable that your supports might sometimes prematurely gloat, or you might feel the need to try to comment publicly or privately, or Adam might feel the need to jet around the world.
Because a large chunk of people have rejected your code.
And because many more can and will - and they'll do in the blink of an eye.
Classic is still out there, "waiting in the wings", ready to be installed, whenever the investors tell the miners that it is needed.
Fortunately for big-block supporters, in this "election", the polls don't stay open for just one day, like in national elections.
The voting for Classic is on-going - it runs for two years. It is happening now, and it will continue to happen until around January 1, 2018 (which is when Classic-as-an-option has been set to officially "expire").
To make a weird comparison with American presidential politics: It's kinda like if either Hillary or Trump were already in office - but meanwhile there was also an ongoing election (where people could change their votes as often as they want), and the day when people got fed up with the incompetent incumbent, they can throw them out (and install someone like Bernie instead) in the blink of an eye.
So while the inertia does favor the incumbent (because people are lazy: it takes them a while to become informed, or fed up, or panicked), this kind of long-running, basically never-ending election favors the insurgent (because once the incumbent visibly screws up, the insurgent gets adopted - permanently).
Everyone knows that Satoshi explicitly defined Bitcoin to be a voting system, in and of itself. Not only does the network vote on which valid block to append next to the chain - the network also votes on the very definition of what a "valid block" is.
Go ahead and re-read the anonymous PDF that was recently posted on the subject of how you are dangerously centralizing Bitcoin by trying to prevent any votes from taking place:
https://np.reddit.com/btc/comments/4hxlquhoh_a_warning_regarding_the_onset_of_centralised/
The insurgent (Classic, Unlimited) is right (they maximally use available bandwidth) - while the incumbent (Core) is wrong (it needlessly throws bandwidth out the window, choking the network, suppressing volume, and hurting the price).
And you, and Adam, and Austin Hill - and your funders from the Bilderberg Group - must be freaking out that there is no way you can get rid of Classic (due to the open-source nature of cryptocurrency and Bitcoin).
Cripple-code will always be rejected by the network.
Classic is already running on about 20%-25% of nodes, and there is nothing you can do to stop it - except commenting on these threads, or having guys like Adam flying around the world doing PowerPoints, etc.
Everything you do is irrelevant when compared against billions of dollars in current wealth (and possibly trillions more down the road) which needs and wants and will get bigger blocks.
You guys no longer even make technical arguments against bigger blocks - because there are none: Classic's codebase is 99% the same as Core, except with bigger blocks.
So when we do finally get bigger blocks, we will get them very, very fast: because it only takes a few hours to upgrade the software to keep all the good crypto and networking code that Core/Blockstream wrote - while tossing that single line of 1 MB "max blocksize" cripple-code from Core/Blockstream into the dustbin of history - just like people did with the Berlin Wall.
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Antminer S7 heat ventilation using ducting.

Toomim Bros. Bitcoin Mining Concern 16,568 views. 7:43. Total IDIOTS at Ships - Ship Fail Compilation #2 Commentary - Duration: 10:02. MrWinning Fun Recommended for you. 10:02. Tree Cutting Fails ... Mini Bitcoin Farm Inside A HVAC System Using Antminer s7 To Heat My House for FREE - Duration: 26:33. TheBitcoinMiner 13,626 views Toomim Bros. Bitcoin Mining Concern uploaded a video 5 years ago 7:43. Toomim Bros cooling system - Duration: 7 minutes, 43 seconds. Toomim Bros. Bitcoin Mining Concern. 5 years ago ; 16,714 views ... Toomim Bros cooling system - Duration: 7:43. ... How to set UP BITCOIN Mining BY BITMAIN Antminer L3+ For Best Air Circulation - Duration: 3:22. Crypto BROS. 146,895 views. 3:22 . Crypto GPU ... How to set UP BITCOIN Mining BY BITMAIN Antminer L3+ For Best Air Circulation - Duration: 3:22. Crypto BROS. 146,161 views. 3:22 ... Toomim Bros cooling system - Duration: 7:43. Toomim Bros ...

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